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Old 07-31-05   #1
Lenina
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The warped minds of the wholesome christians.

So tonight, I was watching this documentry on theis family that were having some problems with ghosts.

They live in America, in a house that is supposed to be haunted by a few ghosts. Their oldest Daughter was talking with a ghost for years and stuff. It was her friend or something, she is now in her teens and their youngest daughter is also doing the same. Now the paranormal investigaters were telling them that the women have ESP or something. Anyway, they sent another psychic in there and the psychic told them about a few ghosts in there. Angry ghosts, nice ghosts, a little girl ghost etc...

Thats just the background... The thing that has really pissed me off is, when I was watching this documentry, the family were going to this church and the priest there were telling the family that there were no ghosts in that house... Only one demon and that the demon befriended the little girl to get into the house etc...

The reason this angers me is that he said through fasting and prayer, it would be gone... They did and 'the demon' didn't go away. It angers me to see how fucking warped the church is. Preying on desperate families to keep them coming back to church. It is fucking horrible. The family were beside themselves with fear and then the fucking priest is all like "Well you are being minipulated by the devil because you have this ability to see the demon". Its fucking sick! Now the oldest daughter, instead of accepting and embracing her gift, studying it and understanding a little more to put her mind at ease and give her a better sense of self, She has pushed her gift away and chose to ignore what she has. She still apparently see's ghosts but she doesn't want to know about it.

Just another reason why I HATE RELIGION! Sick fucks! If anything, the only demon minipulating that family is the fucking church. It just angers me so much! Maybe if they actually did something for them, sent them to an expert who would help the family get a better understanding instead of going "We will prey for you, we will drive the demon away with the love of jesus" and all that bullshit, they would feel a little better, even if it didn't get rid of the ghosts or demon or whatever the fuck they want to call it. They need knowledge... Not a fucking church to hide behind, they are sheep... They can't do anything because they won't help themselves....

I fucking hate religion... Fucking warped sick fucks...
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Old 07-31-05   #2
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Well they wanted a religious answer so they went to the church. I wouldnt go to the church for a scientific one would you? You cant blame the church for one priests suggestion, he was probably guesstimating like pretty much everyone else when they talk about the paranormal. I dont remember the priests being schooled in demonic or ghost like subjects. I personally do not believe in ghosts or ESP, I think the family should have had thier heads checked to let thier kid be taking in by psychics telling her she has ESP, what a load of crap. The best answer in my opinion would have been

A. to move
and
B. to get thier daughter started on psycho therepy.
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Old 07-31-05   #3
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Thier daughter was 4 years old when she started talking to her first 'ghost'. SHe called him Mr Gordy I think. Her family found out that the old caretaker of their home in the 60's was a guy called James Gordy. The old owner brought pictures of her family and friends and the little girl identified James Gordy and another person she had seen, the girl called him "Con" and he had one hand and the old owner said that the guy called 'con' was called 'Lon' or something and that he lost his hand as a teen and died 20 years before.

Yeah like sure... The kid needed psycho therapy... I doubt it would have helped much... I am quite a skeptic at times and that even got me thinking. Nobody ever listens to children... Sending her to psychotheraphy would cause more emotional damage. I am a mother of two and I wouldn't do that... I would however... Move.

They didn't need the churches help, if that is what church help is then I would tell them to kiss my ass. They did need to move, it wouldn't have stopped the little girl from seeing these things but it may have given her a little more peace of mind and maybe then she could have studied what she has and given her a better sense of self... An ability like that should be embraced to give her more confidence and more understanding.

The church is fucked. They terrified that family and preyed on them. Minipulated them into going back there... If anything, if it were me, I would have attempted to seek guidence in a real psychic and work from there....

Why do people with closed minds always open their mouths?
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Old 07-31-05   #4
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I still say it was a fluke, I one time thought I was talking to a spirit too when I was a kid, turned out to be my overactive imagination. I even named the ghost I was talking to, and what scared my mother was that it was the name of the guy who died of an OD in the shithole apartment we were living in before we moved in. She thought I saw a ghost too, the reality is i overheard my father and uncle talking about it one time, name and everything. I made the rest up. I never told my mother this, to this day she thinks ghosts are attracted to me.

The church isnt fucked... it really doesnt benefit the church to have people comming to it scared in the way youre talking of. Especially if they cannot offer any real help.

I would rather put a ciggerette out in my eye than take my child EVER to a "psychic" the very idea of a person with ESP is so laughable that I dont know what else to say about it.

Remember that these TV docudramas are made a certain way with a bend to the facts in order to make them interesting. If every one of them said at the end "oh yeah the kid overheard the father talking about gordy" We probably wouldnt watch them anymore. There was a famous local legend of a haunted house here as well with a kid who allegedly became possessed by a demon and tried to murder his brother, turns out he was really just schizofrenic(sp?) and when he overheard his father talking to his mother about thier house being a funeral home at one point and his bedroom being the old embalming room it put him over the edge. It was even on TV whichw as eerie because this was a storyI grew up hearing on a local level, then it was on A&E called "a Haunting in New England" or something. It had a bend to the facts that negated the issue of the kids mental instability, which was in all the newspapers when the thing actually happend in the 80s. It was good tv watching, but far from accurate.


Good question by the way, what is your definition of a closed mind? Someone who disagrees with you?
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Old 08-01-05   #5
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No, a closed mind is someone who is not open to a possibility... Yeah, I am open to the possibility that there is no such thing as ghosts, ESP, Telepathy etc... DOesn't mean to say that I will not explore in detail, anything that I think would push my mind through reasonable doubt...

It is not as if I want to believe either... I don't want to believe it, like I said, I am a skeptic at times but that doesn't mean I don't want to be knowledgeable in that area at all.

I want to learn, knowledge is the greatest thing you can have, following others blindly is bullshit, you can't get by in life if you follow.

I think religion is bullshit... All religion is, Christian, Hindu, even Satanism is bullshit... Full of self-hypocrtitical idiots that follow someone else... That family were attempting to seek solice in god and all they found was more fear and the notion that if they don't go to church and prey to god and put money on the fucking collection plate, they would be dammned because the 'demon' was trying to get at them...

Its bullshit.

I am aware of of people with mental illness, my cousin suffers from a severe mental illness and it is horrible to hear that her condition has deteriorated because I care for her so much and there is nothing I can do to help her other than be there for her. Mental illness and demonic posession have gone hand in hand for centuries. The Catholic church's apparition... It is bullshit... I am open to the possibility that there is a devil and there is a god... But I don't believe that the church can save everyone if they go and deny themselves the right to live a full life. To dedicate each waking moment to 'god', to confess a 'sin'. Sin's are what make us human and it is in our nature... The church is bullshit... Fuck them.
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Old 08-01-05   #6
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Dont you think you sound closed minded when dealing with religion?

ANd demon posession wasnt invented by the Roman Catholics, its been around allegedly since before there was written languages.
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Old 08-01-05   #7
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i agree...but then...i view religion the same way as lenina..
..based on personal experience..
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Old 08-01-05   #8
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I am not saying anyone has ot view it in whichever way, I fully understand that some people got a chip on thier shoulder when it comes to religion, and some people simply do not mind it. I tend to be more spiritual myself as opposed to religious, but I retain my organized religion for heritage purposes. My family has been raised a certain way for a few 1000 years, I enjoy my culture and the close knit community my family created between itself and wish to carry on that legacy to my own kids one day.

But still saying someone is closed minded because they are religious or whatever, and youre not even though you despise religion in a wierd and irraitonal way is just silly.
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Old 08-01-05   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J0hnnyReb
I am not saying anyone has ot view it in whichever way, I fully understand that some people got a chip on thier shoulder when it comes to religion, and some people simply do not mind it. I tend to be more spiritual myself as opposed to religious, but I retain my organized religion for heritage purposes. My family has been raised a certain way for a few 1000 years, I enjoy my culture and the close knit community my family created between itself and wish to carry on that legacy to my own kids one day.

But still saying someone is closed minded because they are religious or whatever, and youre not even though you despise religion in a wierd and irraitonal way is just silly.
i never said i wasnt closed minded..
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Old 08-01-05   #10
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Quote:
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i never said i wasnt closed minded..
I never said you said that.
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Old 08-01-05   #11
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Quote:
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I fucking hate religion... Fucking warped sick fucks...
Yes, because the psychics warning them about all the ghosts in their house are so much better and have the best interests of the family in mind...
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I feel this way on DF...a lot.
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Old 08-01-05   #12
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I never said you said that.
i am well aware that you never said i said that....i was only making a point..
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Old 08-08-05   #13
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All I am saying is that, the nature of 'good christians' are more satanic than anything else. I realize this through experience... Bad experience and what I and my family are going through at the moment. Its bullshit.

I think that family should have just studied it instead of getting opinons from psychics and churches.

They did have a paranormal investigator in there, he was coming up with scientific explainations....

To each their own...

I just thinking that christianity is bullshit and full of self-centred dickholes that force their billshit onto other people and if they don't listen then they act like fucking babies....

Fuck them.
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Old 08-08-05   #14
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i must say, im with you Len. but mostly because of my own personal experiences.
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Old 08-08-05   #15
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I believe that the new testament should be relabled..

Something like
"How to get along with your fellow humans! and other funny happennings" or
"A Humans Guide to Humans and other wierd stories."
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Old 08-08-05   #16
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Yeah, check out the letter I wrote to Sebastian's "christian" Parents. They have done nothing but piss and moan. They now can well and truely shove their christianity up their asses.

Quote:
Dear Judith,

In light of the recent chain of events, I have decided to write you this email. Sebastian was kind enough to let me use his email address as my address server is always down.

Anyway, first of all, I just would like the opportunity to defend myself in this debate you have going on here.

I am aware of the things you are both saying and it is hurting my feelings. I do not wish to be at the butt of venomous attempts at indirecticly attacking me, if you have something to say then say it to me instead of being passive. It is not normal behaviour for an adult.

I would also like to set you both straight on a few things, such as, I DID NOT, tell Dennis that I came here to sever all my ties to the UK, if that were the case then I would not be in constant contact with my son and my family, besides, I would NEVER say that, I love my son and he has nothing to with this argument that the both of you have spawned so my family and I would appraciate it if you would keep him and my relationship with him, out of this.

Despite what either of you think, I am not "leading Sebastian down the garden path", I am not taking him there to leave him and take his children away from him, what you have said to him about that is just cruel and unkind. I find you both very hypocritical, you call yourselves 'good christians' but when we do not do what you want us to do, you turn on Both Sebastian and myself and I find that horrible behavour. I have put up with alot from the both of you and I am not standing for that. It is one thing to be upset about us leaving but it is another thing when you both attempt to split up a family. Having said that, it again, has nothing to do with either of you what either Sebastian or myself decide, you may think it is bad decision but that is just your opinion and we are not looking for a negative input on this decision, we are looking for support, which we have plenty of. I find you both very twisted and cruel to even say anything like that and I just can not stress to you enough how upset I am at you both for being so mean.

Upon both you and Dennis telling Sebastian that the rest of the family do not approve and they are 'on your side', I took the liberty of contacting them about it. Upon them explaining to Sebastian and myself that what you declared to Sebastian deems untrue, I no longer trust either of you. I am not sure about Sebastian but he is not very happy with that. Both Sebastian and I would appreciate it if you would keep whatever resentment you both have, to yourselves and not involve the rest of Sebastians family in the acidic nihilism that they do not wish to be part of.

I am very unhappy in Canada now, you both have made it difficult for me to want to stay here and be subjected any longer to your hurtful scare tactics. Therefore I must digress from the both of you. I do not like the way you have tried to twist your problems onto Sebastian and how you have used me as an outlett for your anger. It is wrong and it has made me come to the conclusion that you both will never change so reluctantly, I must tell you both to leave me alone.

I am aware of the help the both of you have given us and we are greatful, but if we had of known that the both of you were going to throw it back in our faces when you don't like a decision we make on our own then we would have refused your offer. Again, we are not obligated to either of you to bend to your will, when all you have really shown us is how horrible you both can be when we do something that you didn't decide for us. We offer you back all things you have given us, come and collect them once the rest of the apartment has been cleared out but give us notice as I do not want to be here.

As for your demands to see Sorcha. Demand something and you get nothing. It is that simple, once you have learned to be civil, then you may come see her. What I do not appreciate is either of you coming into this apartment and shouting in front of my daughter and acting like crazy people. That is unacceptable and I have a good mind to not let either of you back into this place or see Sorcha again for the stunt Dennis pulled. Do not talk down to me, you hold no authority over me and if you think that either of you do then do not bother coming over. I will not have my daughter, thinking it is okay to talk to people and insult them in the way that Dennis did and that is the last sort of impression that you want to be giving her.


Sebastian is not heartless and neither am I, we have both decided on what is best for our children and my son Brandon. We both believe that this is what is best. Niether of us are using Sorcha as a tool and just you saying is not going to throw us into guilt. You are the ones using our daughter as a tool and it is our duty as parents to stop that where it is, do not involve Sorcha in your disputes, as I have said before, you can not come into someones place and shout at them in front of their infant and that is disregarding Sorcha's feelings, she is innocent. Neither I or Sebastian want you to do that in front of our child. We are protecting her from all of this, and once you realize that you are adding to the stress and decide that it is time to grow up, then you may come see her. Until then, you may not because we do not want Sorcha subjected to that hatefulness.

So far, during all of these outbursts, I have kept more of less silent. Mainly because I thought that you both were going to be adults about this and see the error of your ways. A forced apology and a few photo's are not really what I wanted to see.

As far the blame game is concerned, you both have nobody to blame but yourselves, as adults, you must take responsability for your own actions. Both Sebastian and myself are taking responsability for our lives so why don't the both of you take responsability for your own lives instead of blaming other people for it. That in itself is childish. For a change, why don't you both grow up.

The whole thing of bringing brandon to canada is NEVER going to happen. Not only is the relationship with my son no concern of yours but it will never happen due to the fact that I don't want to take him away from Peter. Peter is a good father and once we return to the UK, I can see him anytime I want and not give up my rights as a parent.


Sebastian and I are working to better our family and our situation, we believe that we can both provide a happier, healthier and fuller life for our children in the UK. We understand your point of view and concerns but all we can do is ensure you that we have both put alot of thought and research into this decision. We know that moving to the UK will undoubtedly be a difficult task and poses its own problems but the benifits for our family will far outweigh the difficulties.

All we were looking for was the both of you to at least be happy for us and despite the distance remain close and have a part of our children's and our lives but if you wish to be bitter about that then that is also fine. We will remain in contact through email, letters and phonecalls if you decide to be civil.

I can not tell you enough how upset I am at you both for pushing this onto my family, but I do not want either of you to think that I am taking Sebastian and Sorcha away from you, I just think that it is better for the both of you to realize what you have both brought upon yourselves. Unlike either of you, I have not asked or demanded Sebastian to chose between you and his family. Now this can go one of two ways:

You can hate me even more.

Or:

You can stop acting so hateful.

To be honest, I am done being at the end of your hurtful words, I am done being the bad person and Sebastian is done taking the fall for your lives. Make your choice and stay with it because we really can't take anymore of this.

Dispite the bluntness of this letter, I hope that the both of you will stop this stupidity, if not then you both have to live with that.

Take care.

Leanne.

PS, I may be having twins.
Yeah, like they are going to be nice with me after that.... Thats a fucking christian for you... Always showing their double standard bullshit, it is okay for them to hate others but if others have a problem... Oh thats just wrong!
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Old 08-08-05   #17
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Quote:
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Yeah, check out the letter I wrote to Sebastian's "christian" Parents. They have done nothing but piss and moan. They now can well and truely shove their christianity up their asses.



Yeah, like they are going to be nice with me after that.... Thats a fucking christian for you... Always showing their double standard bullshit, it is okay for them to hate others but if others have a problem... Oh thats just wrong!
I think it was an incredibly stupid thing to do. And the bit about twins at the end is utter cruelty. I dont care what they did to you it was uncalled for. You show a lot of double standards yourself. You sya theyre bad for being Christian and yet you act even worse. I had respect for you before and now have a little less for you now. I know I dont know the whole story and I know I dont know everyhting they did but the facts are youre working with them to rip them away from thier son and granchildren and taking them to England apparently. How would you feel if your ex husband (Peter) decided he was going to marry some South African woman and moved to South Africa despite wether you wanted to see your child again or not? Im sure you would be more than a little angry. Take that into perspective.
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Old 08-08-05   #18
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I think it was an incredibly stupid thing to do. And the bit about twins at the end is utter cruelty. I dont care what they did to you it was uncalled for. You show a lot of double standards yourself. You sya theyre bad for being Christian and yet you act even worse. I had respect for you before and now have a little less for you now. I know I dont know the whole story and I know I dont know everyhting they did but the facts are youre working with them to rip them away from thier son and granchildren and taking them to England apparently. How would you feel if your ex husband (Peter) decided he was going to marry some South African woman and moved to South Africa despite wether you wanted to see your child again or not? Im sure you would be more than a little angry. Take that into perspective.
What the fuck do you know? I am not taking any shit from anyone, they have put me and my family through enough so fuck you.

I am not having some bullshit christian telling me what my family and myself are going to do.

I AM NOT GOING TO HAVE SOMEONE TALK SHIT ABOUT ME AND GET AWAY WITH IT.

You know shit about the situation and I can post what the fuck I want to them, seems to be the double standard thing again, so it is okay for them to hurt me and my family over and over and over but it is not okay for me to tell them to fucking stop?

You know shit... So shut up.
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Old 08-08-05   #19
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I see you talk a lot of shit about them and then hurt them and then think its somehow justified. I mean its pretty unrealisitc. There were likely ways to settle this issue that would have been better for everyone involved especially the kids, but you were IMO too prideful. Hopefully you can calm down and they can calm down and talk peacefully down the road, as it is now though you both did a lot of bridge burning. And dont think this isnt affecting your husband too. If your relationship with them never gets better, and you and Sebastion fall on ahrd times it wont take much for him to start seeing you as the woman who ran his parents off, irregardless of who threw the 1st stone. Something to think about.
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Old 08-08-05   #20
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BY TH WAY:

I am thinking of my family's feelings and not theirs. At least I am taking responsability for my own shit.... WHich is more than I can say for the good christians... Its nice to have scapegoat isn't it? Well I am nobodies scapegoat. THey can either suck it up and stop being assholes with me or they can continue acting like assholes and get nothing...

They are not demanding shit from me, they can fuck off if they want to talk down to me too. They are not better than me... After all they have done to me and my family, they demand shit? Who the fuck do they think they are?

And another thing, they were more than prepared to tell me to fucking leave by myself and stay in the UK with my unborn child while they keep Sorcha and Seb... So in my eyes, they don't give a rats ass about my unborn child(ren) so that will not effect them will it. If they are prepared to get rid of me and the baby (or babies) I am carrying. So just goes to show that:

A. You know jack and shit.

B. They are the cruel and fucked up people.

C. They can tell me to let go of my 4 year old son and have nothing more to do with him but they can't let go of their 27 year old son and let him live his own life.

D. You know shit.
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