someone, an old pal, argued me that there is no real good or bad, i pointed out, even starwars knows killing is wrong.

what IS good and bad.

i see it like this.

doing something that causes pain/hurt is BAD
not doing something that causes happyness or nothing at all is GOOD

thus we can judge our actions and responsibilites.

this does also mean that a god, or a force of nature, can be wrong/bad, no matter how devine and pleasant, but then im just an ordinary bloke.

You're Right under a Jewish-Christian Point of View . . .
I'm speaking about to kill the others ( like starting a War).
But many People in this World think that is Good to Me could be terrible Bad for You. . .I'm speaking about what you call Voodoo practices. . .

it's people that need good and evil to describe acts...i do a lot of good, but i'm known for destructive tendencies...and have been known to enjoy them.

even pain and suffering are necessary if you take their lessons to heart, and to live completely with blissfull happiness, being more positive than negative takes a lot of work...one has to acknowledge the pain and suffering before one can be free of it.

man makes god, god will be whatever man wants him to be, or what he can convince others god is...(that's man in a universal sense)

Boogie, i wasnt reffering to a jewish or christian point of view, it may condemn me to some people but i dont actually like either people.

J. gods/goddess arent dependant on man, they do whatever they want at their own pace and time irrespective of us, rather it is we that are dependant on them for many reasons, even those who dont belive in them, require them for those said people to dissablive if you get my point.

i do agree. a person must accept, notice and acknowledge their own "evil" the same way they most accept their addiction, to alchohol of drugs before they can begin to mend. the same way we had to foce and beat the nazis into seeing they were doing wrong to stop them.....however somepeople can plainly see it like they can see clouds and so dont need others to open their eyes. i knew a girl who was happily slutty, took drugs, regarded herself the biggest brain in the world, lied through her teeth and went hunting murduring little innocent animals that cant get away from guns in time....then made the excuse it wasnt her fault it was all her farthers....then she turns around and says to some of us, that she, without a shadow of a doubt, is a good person. often those who preech their good/greatness are the ones with the bloodyest hands.

the fact that the world is painful and life brings both pain and happyness does not in anyway make it right or give the right to cause pain and enjoy it. i dont refer to pain as in sexually though bondage or whatever.....i mean cruel hurtful pain, and theres no excuse. doing a good doesnt remove the bad we have done.

before man was conscious, there were no gods or godesses...just existance...but i've always leaned towards the empirical approach to life...

well thats your oppinion on that subject, but it still doesnt change my point over right or wrong, this isnt a debate over whos belif system on gods is right

I suppose trhat there are things that we can call Absolutes.
This could be absolutely wrong under Every Point of View and that absolutely right . . .
Like the love of a mother or the extinction of an animal variety. . .
Whatever in the minimal of everyday things are still relative.

to a degree one can only live day by day and strive to do their best as well as being led by their heart. the fact is I understand im just a man, i dont have super powers so i carnt end world hunger in a day and i carnt save everylife. but i do do what i can do. it surpises me that the standards and morals i set for my self are found unachivable by many people which makes they violent towards me.

Your values are correct .From my part I explain only a philosophic point of view ,kind what is good what is wrong. . .Like people throwing bombs over women ,children and old people in name of God. . .
But is OK , is Right if noone kilkls or take what is belonging to others and all the values that we all know ,this will be a better world. . .

thats the kind of thing im saying, look at joan of arc, how she was oppressed by the church because she was serving her gods will. now her god throughout history has been a pretty tough cookie, he's all about vengance and teh sacrifice. thus joan took to war, the church was happy to use the knights templer, but soon turned on them like they did joan, because they were serving themselves and not their god. you have to have the streangth of your own convictions to stand before a god and say it's wrong to kill, and perhaps wheni die i may have to, i dont know, but i would be willing to.

The God of Christian is a bloodthirsty god ;that's why we have a softened version
of him in the AfroAmerican cults. . .

"good" and "bad" are man-made concepts, just like time...

its how our parents raise us determine wat we each consider good or bad...

if a child was given birth on an island and was self raised there, alone, i bet that child would have really different views of wat good and bad would be.... our thought process is conditioned by the strongest influences, who are mainly our parents in most cases...

interesting. however good and bad does not soly exist within our own race. animals of all kinds understand whats good and whats bad on many levels and we can also assume other races that exist in space also understand whats good and bad, meaning it isnt a human invention, simply the words good and bad are, but then differnt nationalitys speak differntly. time....well although thats another point, actually time isnt a manmade conception, the sun rises and falls, some animals know to feed at a certain time and nip in for dusk. then theres age. your reffering to measureing time

to a degree i agree with you that our parents can help define what we percive as good and bad.....but we are also able to discern whats good and bad on our own. for instance i chose to become vegetarian when i was five, on my own, and it happend because i leanrt that meat was pigs and cows. there and then i made a big moral decistion i have always stuck by not to condone hurting animals. now some have said "oh well it's because of your parents", my mother was vege, but very young, which is why she allowed my farther to continue eating meat and keeping it in the house. my farther said i should choose when i was old enough, which surrpised him when I decided, on my own, to be vege, and then I made it clear that no more meat would be cept in the house.

it doesnt take a big leap to understand that pain is wrong, even our own bodies tell us this by useing pain as a warning that something is wrong with our bodies. thus many people stick their hands in the fire and dont do it again (again something i never did lol). i was lucky that i could become vege without hurting anything, or through a terrible experiance. but many do at some point in their lives have such an experiance of either hurting animals or someone doing so which changes them......this is the same in the wild.

im not saying your wrong, just offering my interpretation

there is only power, and those to weak to seek it!

your half right.....i have that power. my body is at it's peak and ive been tought many differnt ways to kill thought life as well as forms of defence. i could pop you, and others like a squshy grape. but i choose not to. no matter what ANYONE thinks or says i choose to respect life and to defend it....so i guess that makes squishy grapes like you lucky in this world

keep your "squishy" thoughts to yourself!
life is meaningless
death is power

death will always play second fiddle to life

I tend to view good and evil as a balance... like yen and yang. However if it is definition you seek... I have found this to be acceptable to most people. Good is any act preformed in the service for another... the intent must be the well being of someone else above your own well being. Neutral is looking after you and yours... most people fall into this one. Evil is any action with the intent of personal gain or satisfaction... though I would have to add Apathy to evil as well... "If a good man stands by and does nothing, that is evil enough."

Shadow_Phires ~ Eyes burning, forever watching... learning

your last comment is good about a good man doing nothing. this is what makes me say there is no neutral or middle ground, nor ying and yang. If you kill a rapist because they are going to attack you.....it's still wrong to take a life, but you have stopped them from hurting you and many others. stopping him is right, killing him or her is wrong. im not condoneing letting yourself be abused, despite the combat skills i teach i would be likly to kill an attacker myself, but i do understand i would be wrong to take another life. i also know theres many ways to stop a villian that arent lethal, see how well they do when their eye balls are out of their head and dangling in your hand lol.

Good is when you do something for the benefit of another.

Evil is when you do something for yourself that will harm another.