I’ve just watched Bowling for Columbine, by Michael Moore. I’m reeling from it; it rocked me to the core. Nothing surprised me though, but it was the details that left me amazed. I think every American ought to watch this film.



I understand that every country has fucked up, every nation has its histories worthy of severe condemnation, but from my perspective I feel a great majority of these nations acknowledge the fact that they have done wrong. I feel, given what I have encountered on the internet that Americans believe themselves to be above reproach and that the leadership of that country has done nothing wrong. Whether you’re a Democrat or Republican, at one point or another either was being represented in office, thereby making most all Americans feel protective over the leadership.



Why I feel this movie is so crucial is because of the fact that it’s in your face, it gives one food for thought, it’s harrowing and provocative and I think the part that was most shocking of all was Charlton Heston.



I have just seen that of course things were written about the film slamming its validity, which is to be expected. I doubt that Michael Moore made up the statistics; the comparisons between Canada and America were stark and accurate as far as deaths by handguns are concerned. He’s raised very pertinent questions, most of which come down to the fact that government and media feed the masses with falsities and propaganda. And for that reason alone it’s vitally important to see this film.



If you wish to discredit the film then fine, but you cannot deny the fact that a six year old boy shot a fellow classmate with a handgun, or ignore Columbine at all.

It's pretty biased

Biased to whom? I think it was trying to make a point. About guns, about poverty, about kids murdering kids, about American leadership diverting attention away from problems at home by invasion of a foreign country. The person who made the film is a member of the NRA, a lifelong member too!

Pardon the red font by the way, I had to type it in word as there is a problem with my DF skin, I can't see when I type in a reply box, unfortunately it pasted my word font and colour.


What I found amazing was when Michael interviewed one of the Nichols (I think) brothers, the one that got off free, the old guy said that he arms himself because it's his right as an American to arm himself. Michael then mentioned that Ghandi managed to "defeat" the entire British empire without ever having to resort to violence nevermind a gun, and this person had never even heard of Ghandi.

It ends up not making a point about guns though. At the end he's asking 'Canada has as many guns as we do, why are their gun deaths so much lower than here?'

It does touch on poverty, but never really got into it.

That's very odd, I found that it was very much a focus. The entire film does not have to be about poverty for it to make a statement about it. The fact that Canada was specifically used was because he was able to go there and interview people. He drew comparisons with many other countries too, making the point that every single country has a history of voilence, that each were born from voilence. Yet it doesn't explain why America has such a high death rate by means of guns. I mean my god, WalMart sold fucking bullets for 19 cents!!!!!!

I don't get how you derive your conclusion that it doesn't make a point about guns, how do you figure. I think it makes a very lucid point, America is force fed fear, fear exists everywhere in the world yes, but the statistics do tell a story. I'm not saying it's ONLY in America, I'm saying Americans should realize, should awaken to certain truths. If this was an expose on my own country I would say the same, if it was about a European country I would have said the same. When you're given such visuals, you should sit up and take notice of your enviroment.

It did seem to be pretty biased against guns and the NRA.
Its a good movie though, I like the cartoon.

Yeah, so what's that got to do with the presence of guns?

Huh? I don't get your question. If you instill fear in a nation of people, what are they going to do? Arm themselves to the hilt. And that is precisely what America does.

So has Canada, yet we have alot less gun deaths. Perhaps the fear is the cause, not the guns.

I doubt the parents of the little six year old girl would feel that way, or the parents of the Columbine students who got gunned down. But yes, of course there are two sides to every story. I don't particularly focus on that, I focus on the realities of bullshit media and politicians feed the masses. The harsh realities of America's relationship/bloody history with southern Asia,financial support to the very terrorists now hunted and being killed. All the propaganda being fed to the public instills even deeper fear, which causes Americans to feel the need to protect themselves. It promotes racial divides, it creates isolation and in the end it produces death.

Yes and no, I agree with you and that is precisely what his point was. Canada has a large percentage of gun owners too yet you cannot even compare the statistics. But when you can walk into an average shopping centre where you're going to buy your groceries and buy bullets and weapons you're adding to an enormous problem.

They're not much harder to get here.

I'm convinced the presence of weapons isn't the problem, their collective philosophy of life is.

Thats the impression the film gave me. :woo:

I agree, definitely and that point was made, very clearly with the film. It's not just about the guns, it's the leadership, it's the lies and false propaganda, it's the fear messages (i.e. killer bees from Africa?! HAha) it's the imbalances in living standards, poverty, racism, etc. Though these things exist everywhere. I suppose it's just a matter of intensity.

Yeah, though I do think Chris Rock had a point... 5 Thousand Dollars for a bullet, you'll have a lot less "innocent bystanders"!! I think the political aspect coupled with the over abundance and availability is what contributes to the statistics being what they are.


I just think it's an important film for all Americans to see. No matter what it provokes, whether you hate it or agree with it, it's important nonetheless.

The movie does indeed bring up some valid points that should definitely be addressed. However, I have to say I had some problems with the film, especially Moore's penchant for ambush tactics, so that the other person comes off as hostile and he makes it seem like that helps to prove his point.

Case in point: That scene where he fires off some very loaded questions at Dick Clark as he's about to drive off to make an engagement. Why not simply ask the guy for an interview rather than ambush him when he's obviously needing to be elsewhere?

I think that's the biggest reason; they hold the philosophy of 'survival of the fittest' too close there, and that's why the imbalance is so intense there.

True, but he had that attitude with everyone he interviewed. I think the main reason he simply went up to people (Charlton Heston being the only one he seemingly made an appointment with) was because he'd be able to put the person on the spot. There would be no time to pussy foot around the facts or work out predetermined answers, if you know what's coming you can divert the issue. All politicians and public figures do that. Dick Clarke didn't say "You know what, this isn't a good time for me, can you meet up with me later today." He just wanted to avoid any and all questions by the look of it. If you want to get into people's face with the truth you have to do exactly that, and I feel that is why he used that tactic.

You know, all things aside whether you dislike or approve of Michael Moore and what he did, I think that detracts from the purpose of the film. Which is to bring awareness of what can happen in societies, it's something to learn from. I feel anything that can cause us to question the truths we've been fed can only be a good thing. Regardless of the outcome, it's important to ask questions, of our leaders, religious and political. That is what I feel the film was trying to achieve. It's about: "Look at us, look at me, I'm an American, I belong to the NRA but I can still say 'this is wrong, this is fucked up'."

I think it's a valuable lesson, it's about waking up and looking at what's around you, it's about breaking the bounderies of peripheral vision and going within to see if what you've been told to be the truth really resonates with you. If it does, cool, at least it would have brought you (everyone) closer to knowing yourself better.