Well, yes, I have been to church and no I don't go to church now. I have always been a believer in nothing, not god, not anything. My mother was a total bible freak, she believed that god saved her from death as she has a plastic a orta valve and the doctors told my grandparents that she would not live through 24 hours when she was born. But as a child I was lumbered into church, I hated every minute of it. The priest or whatever you called him...(Pastor? Im not sure) Told me I was a sinner and that I would burn in hell for listening to the music I was into (Punk) and said I dressed like the devils child. That freaked me out. I was force fed these lies. My mother caught on about the church's control and effect on people when the priest told her that she should cut my family off totaly (my family were telling her to not give any more money to the church as the congregation had frightened her out of £650.38p) She still believes in god but does not go into church, she thinks that just by knowing god is there, it gives her the strengh to go on. I never believed in god....EVER. Of course this experience has nothing to do with my opinion of the church in general.... The way I think of religion is effected by the ways of religion as a whole. And the dead sea scroll disowned by the church is valid proof to back up the whole thing. Why ask me a question like that anyway? I thought the answer would be obvious to you....

Well, let me start off by saying that I never attacked or insulted your statement. Thus I did not throw any stones. And about the church being greedy and corrupt........who are you to judge? I do not mean that as an insult, I'm just asking. Why you have such a misconception about the church is beyond me. For I personally do not believe the church is needed for salvation, but I still do not condone attacking it. The church is not perfect, but who is? I was a roman catholic for most of my life and I never thought of them as either "greedy" or "corrupt". If you have such a problem with the church, then just don't go. Please friend, take my advice.......let it go.

who is the Church..... any Church of any denomination to judge???
If an organization such as it can pass judgement on single individuals they also should be allowed to judge....

I find truth behind leninas statements that the Church is corrupt.... pick a denomination and you will find an atrocity that has been commited by someone who was placed in a position of power and trust..... sick and twisted individuals sheltered by the very atrocious organizations which produced them and gave them a venue to partake in thier sick desires....

Granted, but as I have said before, no one is perfect. Now when I say the church I'm speaking of every denomination. Now I know that the church judges people and I also that they have no right. But I'm just saying that one should not judge, even if judged.

"If your enemy strikes you.....turn the other cheek"

--Jesus Christ

a) Duh. Some people in the Church are bad. If you were given the notion as a child that being Christian made people inherently good, you're quite right to disavow yourself of that opinion. If, however, you've decided that all, or even most, Christians are selfish control-freaks, or priests or ministers, then you're quite wrong. I've known a dozen ministers in my life at Church (having moved a couple times), only one of whom was even slightly bad. The worst thing I can think of for the rest is a couple were annoying and a few boring. Some of them are among the nicest people I've ever met. People that dedicate their lives to a faith, any faith, generally have a genuine, deep-rooted belief in that faith, which doesn't mean at all that they have to be intolerant, and usually means a devotion to the tenents of that religion involving basic human kindness and charity. Basing your opinions on a 2,000 year old religion that spans the globe and 2 billion souls on a couple bad childhood experiences is just silly. Overall, most major religions are good things. One rarely hears of an Atheist organization funding a hospital or homeless shelter, or sending workers to third World countries, after all.


b) I know the Dead Sea Scrolls weren't written by Jesus because they were merely early holy writings, of about the 1st or 2nd century A.D., if I remember correctly. They were in essence merely an early Bible, though several of the scrolls were later disincluded from the Bible when it was put together centuries later. They're useful in that they're purer, less adulturated versions of holy texts, not corrupted by generations of translations, but the Church is mostly right in not taking them as gospel, seeing as they have no clue who wrote them or when, and even if they were signed "Jesus", which they're not, or "Yeshua", that would hardly be an indicator of authenticity. Locking them away and trying to keep them hushed up is stupid, but then again, they do predict the end of the World in slightly over a decade (again, IIRC), so it's not entirely without reason.


You're right that this forum is for discussion, and that voicing an opinion is better than staying silent, but if that opinion is merely rooted in ignorance, as you yourself said in your first post, maybe you should do a little research before complaining, or at least be a little less offensive and hostile in your initial post.

at least those that are ignorant can learn in here of different opinions. not aimed at anyone at all but applies to all.

stupid fucking olympics are screwing everyhthing up here... I had a good rant going on and it is bye bye due to cable outages left and fucking right... oh well....

I've met a decent priest more concerned with people then god. His faith is his own, but He will happily discuss it with any who choose. he was an ex-naval chaplin who saw service in the Falklands and the gulf. He was a broadminded man and very funny.

But he is in the minority. The rest were few and far between. the church throughout history is a control excercise.

Religion is the opiate of the masses (Karl Marx)

T.V is the new religion (Andy Warhol)

Neon

*hugs dyshade*

it's okay it'll all be over soon...

In your opinion.


"A witty saying proves nothing" -Voltaire.

Ummm.... I have absolutely no problems with devout and good-hearted people whom have decided to be a part of one of the many Christian Denominations out there..... it is the ones that abuse the priviledges they have been granted..... and it is those that decide that it is better to hide the experience under a blanket of quiet shame..... those are the bastards who give every one of you who attempt to do good in your Gods name a bad reputation..... there are a number of different denominations of Christianity which have thier skeletons poking out of the closets... I for one do not condemn the religion.... rather the ones who take advantage of a bestowed position.... I find Christianity confusing and rather odd in its paradoxes and contridictions..... it does however do a lot of good in the world...... though its prosalityzing gets a bit tiring..... I am who I am...... and it certainly seems I am not a Christian......

damn torch passes my coffee shop in the Aves..... grrrr..... I suppose it is okies if I can bilk the Europeans out of a few bucks though.... hehe

mmmmmm...coffee...does coffee become a sin if you indulge yourself in it? kind a like gluttony? If it becomes a passion does that make it a subject for confession? Aren't all things enjoyable supposed to be "evil" due to the power of the church?

What will you never see at my coffee shop?????

Mormons...... though they can drink Mt.Dew.... which I might add has just as much caffiene as one shot of espresso.... possibly a bit more..... they cannot touch coffee..... crazy freaks...

What no coffee!!!, but dew is fine? Any ideas why? wouldn't coffee be more natural...

sure.... the Mormon Church has over 50% stock in the Coca-Cola Corporation...... so they made it okies to drink Coca-cola and Mt.Dew.... more money for the Church.... thats why it is one of the fastest growing Denominations in the World.... they build 100 new churches every year..... sometimes more....

Was all caffeine taboo until they purchased the coca cola company...but dew is a pepsi product!...I guess if they said coca-cola products only, that would make them hypocrits?

*wipes her brow, and sighs in relief*

thought I'd have to boycott code red