I don't agree with abortion per se, and I would never have one myself, but everyone has their reasons and if you get it done asap (ie, before it becomes more than a bunch of cells) then it's not an issue. However this is a gross misconduct of the medical profession.

The baby, or foetus as they like to call it, is pulled with forceps out of the woman's womb until only it's head still remains inside. The doctor then stobs the foetus in the back of the head with surgical scissors to kill it. A tube is then used to suck out the brain so the skull collapses and the dead foetus can be removed.

This is legal in America any time from when the pregnancy is too advanced for a surgical abortion up until birth.

I mean for goodness sake, if you don't want it then carry it to full term (which would be what, a couple of weeks?) and then have it adopted!
It makes me very angry and very sad because I want to save those little tots from the lousy bitches who would do that to them.

abortion.
yeah. i understand that not all women are educated or taught the exact consequences of sex.
i understand all instances of conception are not consentual.
i understand that if the child is not wanted, the quality of life may not be "good".
and i understand that being a mom, single or not, can be absolute hell.

not one of these things take the child's right into consideration. a person can be pro choice, or pro life, but either of those can be understood to mean the opposite at face value. sex needs to stop being so "taboo". we need to start facing it like a facet of life, like humor and using the restroom.
if we get past that nonsense, fewer unwanted pregnancies will happen, and i believe that's because women will begin seeing what other worth they offer to the world aside from their sexuality. that's ONE aspect of life.
man.

once the process of that child's life has begun, the zygote, whether considered "alive" or not yet, the life itself has begun and any attempt at terminating it is at least relative to taking someone's life. how can we be alright with this?
i'm taking petal's stance to extremes.
but see, i gotta choose between how i feel on this issue and the right to collectively bargain. i mean.. you can't have them both. no, because they're so.. relative.. or something.

There will always be people who desperately want babies, and then there are these people who throw them away like you would a nail polish that you don't like.

the problem is the idea that those who feel this way are inconsiderate of the woman that is giving the birth.
look "fair" is not real. it doesnt happen. it's about what's best, for the whole.
in a situation where two lives come out, albeit one is injured and the quality of life for the other is questionable, this far outweighs the other.
one life, and commonly a grievous and resentful one, makes it.

i have to add though, this is the most "eye to eye" i've been with anyone on here in terms of this issue, or maybe any issue actually.
we're gonna get sassed for this, but i feel a hell of a lot better having let all this out. it's an issue that matters to me a lot.

Most women go into abortions without any idea of the emotional trauma. Twenty years down the line the blame, guilt and grief is apportioned.

In some states in the US, murderers are murdered. But surely this is murder?

I've seen the mangled body of a foetus at just the three month stage. It is most definitely a baby.

Ditto with the 'eye to eye' -ness.
Most people have very little comprehension what an abortion actually entails, let alone the one described above.
It's quite topical where I live, because we have the highest rate of teen pregnancy in Europe and most of the girls keep their babies.

Abortion is a horrible subject and as much as I wish it didn't exist, if they were illegal women will stick knitting needles up themselves.

Unfortunately, people are stupid. I have seen medical records on gynie wards that show the particular woman is on her third, fifth, or even once, eight abortion.
They know the score but they just keep doing it.
I hate to make dramatic harsh statements, but I honestly believe these women should be sterilised, whether they like it or not.

I once knew a boy who was the product of rape, and had been put in care by his mother at birth. She had hidden her pregnancy from her parents, hidden the rape in case they had blamed her and thought her dirty, and as the years went by and her son looked more and more like her attacker, she seemed to hate looking at him.
When her parents found out, they disowned her. She tried to look after her son, stay in his life, but she did more harm than good.
He wished he'd been aborted, and at twenty one years old jumped off a railway bridge, and under a train.

Maybe all those involved would have been better off if she's just had an abortion.
Or maybe, if her parents had been supportive, and the baby adopted instead of fostered, able to grow up and never know the facts of his conception, the whole thing could have been avoided.

It's all so fucked up. Rape's difficult too, I couldn't keep a baby conceived in rape by a stranger, i'd have it adopted, but say it was a boyfriend or a partner I don't know.

Hmmm...
I'm just waiting for the pro-choice people to come and do me in.

Ahh sod em.

It's alarming how many pro choicers haven't actually seen a child in a kidney dish, and they should before they vent.

Yeah. I cry alot at that sort of thing.

It does me in too.
Since switching over to the funeral profession I see so many still borns and babies that are deeply mourned over, and for another child of the same worth to basically be thrown away keeps me awake.

the doctor won't make a buck if he imparts this info. so keep it hush for our PhD buddies.
"murder" is just a term, and this can be debated for hours. instead let's just look at it for what it is. a life that would have been, now is not. just imagine what this life could have accomplished. sure, it might have been a total waste. some people are just that. or maybe it was going to the best friend to someone that would have otherwise committed suicide. the possibilities are endless.
but this life won't happen now. i can be no more alright with this than a life that's already started and cut short by mutilation.
i do agree, but i don't find this to even be a matter when you look at what's going on as a whole. whether it's a life to be, or a life that is, it won't go any further now.

contraceptives stop the life of a sperm and an egg from starting a new life that is a zygote. and that will be a person save for miscarriages. but contraceptives are not cutting a life that has begun, short.

that's rather funny because my city has one of the highest teen pregnancies in the US. i know it's in the top 5 of all of them.

as far as the rape issue goes, all i can say is that a man that was born of an incident of rape changed my life for the better when i was a young teen and dealing with a lot of problems. he was the most compassionate person i can remember meeting. his name was sean smith, he was black, and to this day i don't know what type of person i would be had i not met him.
i know most people here aren't big on God, but the words he said were simple. "you don't worry yourself about talkin to people about what life is for. you worry about hearing it from someone higher up." and i have a few friends and relatives that could agree what an impact his life made on us. his mom, by his account, was an amazing woman.

To me all life is precious...

murder is acceptable at times. self defense. war. but do we call it murder? no...

but you know - I still believe we need war...therefore we need murder. all I know is that I am happy that I will be dead by the time mankind uses up all of the earth's resources - so why not go ahead and save a child the burden? I already see arguements against this...

but Im sleepy and dont feel like typing anymore on this topic.

Babies taste better when they're freshly killed. Mmmmmmm MMM.

Sick fucks! Sick, sick fucks! That is just horrible! Man Im disturbed now... Sick fucks.