Awwwwwwww! *Gives sixxx some kisses and hugglefux cuz hes awsome* I read philosopy before, socates once debated about vanity and how someone can be pure.... He was on about how pure and unvain I was...

LOL! Great post.. I am tired of people who "fake" things (depression,ED,cutting) Makes me mad because there are some people who really need help while others fake for attention.

Thats retarded.
You wanna give yourself lung cancer, you go ahead. But to say that other people should just sit and deal with it?

Fuck you.

Of course they should sit there and deal with someone giving themself lung cancer, and you should deal with the occasional fight, its a public house.

Here's the deal with smoking in bars. Read and remember this:

A bar is NOT a PUBLIC place!

A bar is a PRIVATELY OWNED BUSINESS on privately owned land.

Smoking is a legal activity.

If the owner of a privately owned business wants to allow a legal activity on his property, then the gov't has nothing to do with it!

The gov't could make tobacco illegal, but it won't do that because it likes the taxes.

If you don't like smoke, then DON'T GO to any privately owned business that allows the legal activity of SMOKING!

These new gov't regulations are nothing less than a gross violation of private property rights.

Yeah, just to clarify, a public house is not public property, it is a private business that caters to the general public (although they can decide they want certain people, hence dress codes etc.). I certainly agree that it isn't the governments place to intervene since the damage to other people's health is for the most part negligible and probably a great deal less of a risk than crossing the road on your way home.

In a pub you have to put up with other memebers of the public, you have to smell their gaseous emisions and breath the same air and everything.

The gov't is using anti-smoking laws now because of something I don't understand. I haven't seen any non-smoking bars, and there is a market foir that, but bar owners aren't doing it. I was in a bar a few months ago with my co-workers. It was a slightly upscale bar that they picked. After the place filled up, there were at least 200 people in the bar, and only 10 of them, maybe, were smoking. That bar, and places like it, should just become a smoke free bar, and advertise it.

I can't explain why that isn't happening, because that did happen with the airlines. In America, before the FAA made smoking illegal on all domestic flights, United, Delta, and Continental, three of the biggest airlines in the world at that time, made it a corporate policy to not allow smoking on their flights. That's the way the market is supposed to work.

There WAS a non-smokers section... If you want to wander into the smokers section and give yourself lung cancer then good for you...

Smoking is my choice, its not just a habit to me, I enjoy smoking. People are so over critical when it comes to smoking but they never complain about car exhaust fumes and every day polution that is also very bad for you.

Why not boycot the world and tell them its retarded? If they want to drive around in cars and use gas central heating in their homes and poison themselves then they can go right ahead but to say that other people should just sit and deal with it? .... Oh wait... Yeah, yeah we have to sit and deal with it don't we....

I find that in injustice in itself. If you don't want to be around smokers then don't be around smokers... Someone lights up a smoke then fucking move out of the way. We can't escape everyday polution but thats alright... As long as nobody blows cigarette smoke in your breathing space Im sure that every day polution is just a minor factor to you... I will remember that when I go to the store to buy my smokes today, Im going to ask if they can take off the tax because I don't want to pay for your health care or your schools....

I dont care about the legality of it. I dont go to bars where its all smoking, I realise the owner has that right. Thats not what I'm speaking against.

I think its incredibly mornically selfish for you to sit there and say non smokers should just step out of the way. Would you do that if the non smoker was there first?

And how can you be sure that polution is a minor factor to me? I dont use cars. I walk 90% of the time. I dont have a heater in my house. You know nothing about me.

Have you ever watched someone die of lung cancer, Lenina?

Smoking isn't the cause of lung cancer, its a contributing factor, a carcinogen, so why would it matter?

Its like seeing someone die of hypothermia, it doesn't change my view of AIDs.

Smoking is a HUGE contributing factor.

Yeah, point?

Do I have to watch someone die of suffocation in their sleep due to being obese to have an opinion on obesity?

Should fat people be banned from pubs, swimming pools, aeroplanes?

If you're going to ban something from pubs, ban mobile phones.

Only if they`re carcinogenic.

They should damn sure be banned from airplanes, or at least be forced to buy 2 seats. I hate the big fat fucks who spill over the armrests on an airplane.

It's fair enough to ban something that endangers the lives of those who are exposed to them it them taking part in the activity. I think non-smoking bars take it a bit far, and that if there should be a smoking area if the owner wants it, but that they cannot force any member of staff to enter it against their will. Basically a smoking room, where people can take their drinks.

I recently nursed a woman who has cancer due to passive smoking. She worked in a cab office, with drivers coming in all the time and smoking around her.
She's not dead yet, but she is missing a lung, and I reckon the cancer is on the way to her liver, her skin looks awful.
She has little kids.

On the other hand a while back we had a twenty nine year old who had throat cancer, and it was sucessfully treated, but she won't give up, as, as she puts it 'She could be hit by a bus tomorrow.'
Basically, all the while random death is a possibility, she'll take the risk. She has four children under ten. Sensible, eh?

I think Ditto said about watching someone die, as it is obviously close to her heart. You don't need to see it to have an opinion on it, but it does help to get a better understanding. There used to be courses for people trying to give up at the hospital where I trained, groups of smokers brought around the respiratory ward just to see people of their own age, own social group, dying a horrible, horrible way. Morphine sorts out most pain, you can be taken away from it, but anything to do with breathing means twenty four hour hell. No sleeping, no eating, just pain.
Some people cried, espeically when they saw the families getting ready to say goodbye. Others went outside and lit up in the car park.
A lot of people find excuses, and a lot of people don't care, but it costs the NHS millions more than it's gets in taxes, and when there are children that can be left behind, it scares me.

My dad smoked, and although his death was unrelated, I dealt with it better than any other in my life as I always thought that his life couldn't be that important to him if he would risk it in such a mundane, expensive, pointless way every day.

It's basically a dangerous hobby, but at least if people jump out of planes or rock climb their way to death, there is a comfort in that they died doing something that gave their life meaning and excitement, neither of which you get from smoking. I know, I did it for ten years.

Fat people are more likely to get cancer ...

How do you know it was actually caused by the passive smoking?, well, actually, I have no reason to disbelieve you since yeah, while quite rare people do die from passive smoking related stuff, it is usually people who work everyday in smoke-filled environments. I question the evidence of anyone who claims people die from other people's smoke in a bar they visit.

In fact, I'll bet more people have died from obese people blocking fire exits.

You know, some people do actually enjoy smoking, you can't say its just addiction, otherwise very few people would actually get adicted in the first place.

I have seen death, I had the honour of holding someone in my arms when they passed away, and while its unpleasant, I don't think it should stop people from having fun and doing what they want. (Within certain boundries, but banning people from smoking in bars is not one of them)

No they should not, while obesity is a problem to be address, they are also a reality to be catered for, and their money is good, airplane manufacturers should make planes capable of holding them. As you would say, that's how the market should work.

Ah, no danger to others then....unless they smoke...or fall on people.