i like that idea, however it's, more affordable(grants, scholarships etc.) now to get my children into college when they are at that age...unless, our family goes into debt...then their chances, are slim...

the blemish on my credit keeping them healthy would prevent any oppoturnity for loans, and if we(a married couple) make anything over three thousand a month, they don't qualify for grants or scholarships.

what good would it do, if parents are incapable of providing healthcare, until college age?

they'd have to come up with a bridge for that system to work...why not give citizen's a choice...pay more taxes, based on an income scale to participate in a form of national affordable healthcare or be taxed at a lower rate...and choose to continue, without national healthcare?

...same people paying the taxes, just able to choose what's important for their family, rather than what's convenient for the government.

free healthcare, i realize is not practical, and i personally don't expect that, five years ago, we had health insurance, costing two hundred a month...for insurance that offered several choices for health option costs(we chose the more expensive one that covered pregnancy)standard fifteen dollar co-pay...

given the choice of paying an affordable amount a month for healthcare and keeping my job?!?!

would actually make me happier, than having to quit my job and my husband go part time, so our children can get healthcare...i really love my job, and it pays well, i really don't want to quit, and my husband thrives on forty hours a week.

what's wrong with that picture?

how can "the average joe working schmoe" afford four hundred dollars a month for healthcare, when after bills are paid and groceries puchased they have just enough to keep their family life, enjoyable...

as long as no one gets hurt, having fun.

Here's an idea Jordyn, if you can't afford to raise a child, keep your fucking legs closed. The reason I don't have to worry about anything, as you put it, is because I'm not popping out babies I have to care for. And I don't plan to have any children until I can afford to bring them up healthy and well fed. Jesus, you don't get a dog if you can't afford dog food, you shouldn't have a kid if you can't afford to take it to the fucking doctor.

The world is harsh, unfair, and unkind. No one's going to take care of you. No one's going to give you all the answers. No one's going to make everything alright. You're the only person you can rely on to try and make your life better. Deal with it and adapt to it. Either find an answer or learn to accept your current limitations. There are worse problems than not having enough money, anyway.

.

here's an idea!

...when i had children i could afford them, i had bluecross/blueshield insurance and things were peachy...i settled for two and took medical steps to assure i would have no more...now i can't, afford healthcare?

what happened in the last five years to have changed so drastically...and why do american's with children have to suffer because doctor's are greedy and the government doesn't care about them?

but, women who are as you say "popping out babies" get medical, foodstamps and afdc out of taxpayers money...but because i decided to go the sterilization route...i don't qualify because i got married too?

so don't go that route with me, that's part of the reason i'm so upset about the atrocious state of the american health system...five years ago, i could afford it, eight years ago i could afford it...what drastic change has happened in those years?

now america has become shit for anyone who can't line a politicians pocket, are too single too matter, are single mothers with three children under the age of five, working on number four to keep their benefits and illegal aliens...who with children can qualify for anything...and get paid under the table.

i have my personal answers why the healthcare system is unbalanced...i would like to know why those whi think it's okay that america is failing where other nations excell, and even exceed america when it comes to their citizens and their state of health.

what's most disappointing about this thread, is that people spent to much time focusing on personalizing this thread for their own, hatred of others...versus an actual discussion on why it's impossible for the american government to show a little concern for the plight of "48 million people" or why it really doesn't matter that ten million american children are in the same boat, as mine.

"There are worse problems than not having enough money, anyway."

yeah, hateful people who blame 48 million people for the failings of a government that doesn't do anything for their country, and the rest who don't care, until they need something medical.

http://www.pollingreport.com/BushJob.htm

further proof that i'm not the only one who sees this as one problem of many with the current government, it's not one married mother that chose too have two children, when things were good in america...then bush became president...and turned everything, sucky!

i tried seeing if anyone had any other ideas, why america is failing in providing for it's citizens, but i guess not; so it's back to the most obvious culprit...and more americans are realizing this, poll after poll.

Considering that bush does not make laws nor set the budget gripping about his adminstration relative to your issue is a waste of time. Talk to congress.

I really felt for your plight until the last comment about making life enjoyable. what exactly do you mean by that? I dont care about nor should I have to pay for your enjoyment. If money provides you with enjoyment you need to reavalute how you are living your life and what you need to do to get more money. You keep talking about the welfare people well what do think is there quality of life? I agree healthcare is an issue in this country my problem with the situation is that indivduals whom are on the cusp have no incentive to work the system rewards those indivduals for not working. Bush is right Americans dont want to do the jobs that Mexicans do because whats the point your quality of life is no diffrent between working and not working.

A couple of tips for you the 6000.00 you paid for you kids arm is atleast partialy tax deductable. Second you can withdraw insurance payments from your salary pretax on 3000.00 a month depending on where you live you should be able to afford 400.00 a month for healthcare. It seems that you maybe sacrificing healthcare for a few luxury goods maybe cable, internet a pack of cigs and a six pack a day I dont really know but from your statment about enjoyment I assume your more upset you cant buy a mercedes or something then actually being concerned about healthcare.

You are not entitled to enjoyment nor are you entitled to the "American Dream" you are entitled to pursue that dream though so start pursuing

Didnt you move twice in the past 5 years? yeah it must be Bush's fault though.

enjoyment...taking our children for a picnic in the park on sundays, buying them kites, birthdays, school clothes and supplies, a new pair of sneakers fo the one's they outgrow...maybe a pizza and movie night...if my husband makes his bonuses...being able to by a bag of popcorn when we go to watch free movies(the perks of managing a theatre)taking a drive up to glacier to let them hike for a bit...

we do not smoke, drink, party...we do not make three thousand dollars a month...our basic bills average about 1800(rent, electric, phone, water, car payment, required car insurance, groceries) he works fulltime, averaging about 1200 a month(he did get a fifty cent raise), i work part time(eliminates several hundred dollars more a month for chidcare) averaging about 600 a month.

you're right, if we drop car insurance and default on our car loan...we could afford some sort of healthcare...who needs to bother getting to work or school, and what's a good credit score worth these days?

"Didnt you move twice in the past 5 years? yeah it must be Bush's fault though."

actually, the only part his administration would have had, would be allowing hewlitt packard to out source all their technical support jobs to india...resulting in the loss of several thousand local jobs and affordable healthcare...

we heard the pasture was greener down south, we realized the error of our ways...you've got a point, but...

we couldn't afford healthcare down there either...and the job market was even, worse.

maybe i'll quit my job...and live off the system, it seems people posting on this thread, find that more acceptable than honest workers who would just like to have the ability to take their children to the doctor, without going into debt...how selfish of me...

full medical, four hundred dollars a month for food, section eight rental assistance and twelve hundred dollars a month for cash...i am being stupid for wanting to work, i hear tubal litigation is reversable, maybe i'll have another kid...and see what else i can get for sitting around, having babies.

maybe the forty eight million other, uninsured workers will realize there is a better way, than worrying about working and providing for children.

1200 a month? Where does he work? Walmart?

an outbound call center...he averages a little over six hundred twenty five dollars a paycheck(covers rent)base pay...after taxes, pre tax...there'd be no problems, oh, and he did sign up for sixteen dollars a month for dental...

that's one of the, cons of living in a valley that is geared more for tourists than locals...

our town has actually cappped the pay rate of incoming companies, to keep it fair for the small business, mom and pop stores that can't afford to pay their employees, the rates larger companies can...just a few months ago everything went up to seven dollars an hour...with his raise he'll now be getting nine.

...at other call centers, in other cities...he could be getting paid twice what he is...i won't blame bush for that, i do know the pay rate cap is all local.

Seems to me that your attached to material things like birthday presents and such. I can see it now little Jordyn comes home from school and asks for something you cant afford little Jordyn gets upset and you feel bad because you cant get it. Instead of blaming yourself or changing the situation you balme the goverment specificaly Bush

Here is a list of things you could actually "do" to make a change

A. your husband thrives on 40hrs a week maybe he should consider "thriving" on 60 or 80 hours a week. I know in my area lowes, home depot, fedex, ups provide part time employees with full time befits. ta daa insurance problem solved
B. you or your husband go back to school and get a marketable skill. while in school you can get a student loan that will give you more money then what it costs to go to school usally that amount is signifacantly more use the extra money to pay off debt and buy insurance finish school get better job that provides insurance you good now.
C. Stop working go on welfare ect hey you wont be able to buy the stuff you cant now so you still be pissed but atleast you have health insurance.

In my opinion health insurance is a necassity simliarly to food and energy and houseing (which in case no one realizes is subsidized by the goverment and is why we live in a hybrid socialist capitalist enviroment) and as such should be subsidized by the federal goverement to make it affordabel for all. It should not be given away, Americans should have to pay for it at a reasoable rate simliarly to the other things I mentioned. Unfortunatly that does not exist now so until it does stop whinning and do something. You seem to have time to post on this forum I assume then you could take some classes online.

A lot of european nations have nationalized healthcare. Of course you're paying the same amount in taxes... at least in the US its optional.

Probably more. If youre young here you can go without healthcare if your daring and save money. Over there you just lose 50% of your paycheck before you get it, sick or not. Old or young.

i may have been a little hasty in blaming bush, it does seem he and his administration are taking, baby steps in coming up with something...health savings accounts, couple that with a cheap, high yield sort of insurance...and it can work...we're getting the details.

i find it funny all these bush supporters chose to pass personal judgements, rather than factually pointing out, the fallacy of my, initial statement in blaming bush...i suppose i was silly for expecting more.

do you really believe affordable healthcare and the system currently in place is not an issue for this, nation...or people who are just trying to do the best they can to raise children?

excellent idea, so...should i quit my job so he can work additional hours...essentially eliminating any, excess money that ideal could generate...quitting my job would be hard however, i've worked too long to know how to not...have a job and bring in my own money...i suppose we can attempt to find daycare, for our children, about five dollars an hour each, hopefully we can find one who picks up and drops off at school; we'll go with the low sixty...six hundred dollars, a week, times four weeks equals...twenty four hundred dollars...he'd be bringing in a little over two thousand.

we make about the same, working together, and he qualifies for health insurance, through his work...but at four hundred dollars, that would leave him bringing home about eight hundred dollars a month...add mine eight and we make about sixteen hundred...our bills are at about eighteen hundred, on a good month.

so, aside from eliminating any family time...and complicating our lives having to juggle three jobs, two kids, school and all the appointments entailed with having children...it's not feasible, maybe if we had no children, it would work,

...but children need parents, look at what society has become with all the latch key kids...that's not a sacrifice i want to make, and it's really sad people expect parents to neglect their children's needs, so they can work all the time, just to keep them healthy, especially when they have a disability.

further more, he actually does qualify for health care, through his place of employment; but four hundred dollars a month?

even if we eliminate, non essential bills like internet that still leaves us with three hundred and forty more dollars to go.


student loans!...another excellent ideal!

if our credit wasn't so tied up, and there's a blemish on my credit...we discovered applying for a house loan...if organizations that are designed to help low income people purchase houses turned us down, do you really think a school would happily hand us over, whatever we need...and then it's back to the childcare issue...there's no way one of us could quit a job, to go to school...and we make too much to qualify for grants...otherwise, i would love to go back to school.

marketable skill, i'm management and he's technical support...currently representing bank of america...what exactly do you mean, marketable skill?


actually, i have all i really care to want, need, or desire...well, except owning our own house...

my point with the welfare is that the governents(local and nationally) already have healthcare plans in place...why do they have to exclude people who want to work, showering the benefits on those who are generational welfare participants, single mothers that have children just before their benefits exhaust themself, and have living, off the government down to an art...i have no desire to do so, but it'd be the easiest way to get healthcare...why can't the welfare program be shifted to assist those who have a desire to work, rather than rewarding those who do not?


affordable housing?!?? what planet are you living on...

if gas prices keep going up, so will our food...ask a trucker, they'll give you an earful,

and yes, i do have an hour here, or there, after work, before lunch, between errands and doing annoying domestic things like dishes and making the beds...

but i'm really not on as much as my post count would suggest...there were times when i did have hours to spend on the internet...but that was a long time ago, and we did have affordable health insurance.

this is a good point, i knew you could do it, thank you...but optional?

if i could choose my taxes to go into a healthcare plan versus...whatever the governments involved need my money for, than i'd agree with you one hundred percent...bush's hsa's may work, and i did find a high yield bluecross plane for a little over two hundred...

if we could deposit our tax return into the account...but i'm still checking into these options...it's frustrating that such plans are available, but so few actually know they're available, and the exact process one needs to go through to set one up...the only reason i stumbled across them was wanting to see exactly where bush did stand on health care, i was appropriatly corrected.

he has acknowledged affordable healthcare is a problem for our nation, and has made attempts to help out the "old and poor"(so he says)...but there's still more, that needs to be worked out, it's a step in the right direction, they just need to make it more, available to those it's designed to help, and easier to figure out, exactly.

people can lose much more than half of a paycheck if something untoward does happen...requiring medical attention, and they don't qualify or can't afford anything...we learned that the hard way.

It sounds to me like you have no ambition, Jordyn. You're arguing with die hard capitalists who also don't believe in welfare going to anyone. Whether they're working a shitty job, or working no job. As Billy has stated, its not hard to better your station in life if you're willing to sacrifice in the present. But you don't sound like you are, you have an excuse for every suggestion, and all you can do is complain that you aren't getting your share from the government.

You could move to an area with more opportunities... but you like the town you live in too much. You could go back to school... but you can't get loans. You could work second jobs... but you have to get daycare. If you're unwilling to do anything to better yourself, you should have your whining license revoked.

It sounds like you enjoy working your low paying job, and if it makes you happy thats just fine. Just don't ask for me to subsidize your healthcare because you don't want to take the initiative to get a job that pays more, or provides better insurance. Me, and the rest of the American people, aren't here to make your life easier, you have to do it yourself.

Jordyn

Your kids go to school thats free day care they also go to sleep right? heres a clue for you your husband can load trucks at ups from 4 to 8 in the morning then go to his job. Iam sure there is something in your area that you or your husband can do to pick up extra hours.

houseing is affordable in relative terms if it was a free market alot fewer people could afford homes. What mortgage did you look at, does your husband also have crappy credit, you releazie you can get a federal mortgage where all you have to pay is interest for like 5 years. Student loans are also offered threw the federal goverement and your credit score really wont make much of a diffrence and if your husbands credit doesnt suck maybe he should go back to school.

your jobs arent marketable to the things you want to afford