Originally Posted by Wicked Lady

What about so a hard-working non-whore who pays taxes can get the care he/she needs to survive? Would you subscribe to it then? Or are all of you so intent on keeping the bad ones out that you're refusing to let the good ones in.

Originally Posted by theburningbush

Sorry Billy but the only one of us making ridiculous statements is you. You wont be able to restrict medical care to the moochers unless you close the emregency rooms. Lets focus in on these so called moochers you descibe for a second. Where do they impact the cost of medical care? Ill give you a hint its not at a standard physical that costs about $100.00 and its not at an office visit for a sore throat which is also about $100.00. It is in the Emergency room visit that usally costs about $10,000.00. This is of course not the sole reason that healthcare is on the rise, theres also lawsuits, an aging population base, and poor investment decsions by private insurance entities. You present a ludcris idea of elimanting health insurance althogther and I present a sound logical idea of greater cost distirbution (not because you and I are paying more but becuase more people are paying) and the elimnation of private secotor groups that dont care about the people they serve. Health Insurance is a good fit for goverment the idea of goverment is to protect the public intrest I have yet to lose so much faith in our goverment that I have lost trust in its overall purpose which is to serve you and me and everyone else.

Originally Posted by Dyshade

Like I asked above.... how would you propose we pay for it??
We already pay 20-25% of our wages to taxxes which is more than a 16th century peasant was taxxed in England or France

Originally Posted by theburningbush

do you pay anything for healthcare now?

Originally Posted by Billy the Kidd

youre using the same stinky argument again and again FOR universal coverage. Its absurd.... ooh a few people mooch that we pay for already.. lets just give it to everyone so we are ALL moochers and we cant complain about it anymore. No sir I dont think so, I dont like that logic. I also dont really beleive we should kill off the sick, but its an absurd conclusion on purpose, sadly your absurd conclusion isnt seen as insane like I intended mine to be.

Originally Posted by Dyshade

No. Because I was smart and moved to a right to work state which states that Unions operating in the state must give Union benefits due to all workers in a workplace irregardless of whether or not those workers pay union dues.

I do not pay dues. I work hard. I do not get hurt.

Originally Posted by theburningbush

Ah I see. My argument is not that we have some moochers so we should give eveyone healthcare so that there are no moochers. my argument is that moochers arent part of the decsion matrix because you have them regardless of the system.

Exactly how do we all become moochers if we are taxed for healthcare? you have yet to answer this question.

Originally Posted by theburningbush

so basicaly you mooch your healthcare off of everyone that pays there union dues?

Originally Posted by Billy the Kidd

Yeah but they get taxed other ways too, how much do they pay for gas?

Originally Posted by Billy the Kidd

Because some people will still pay taxes and not use it, thus making everyone else a moocher. I wouldnt use nationalized shitcare. I would use premium healthcare through my employer, thus making me not a moocher, but still have to pay for it. Come up with a national healthcare plan where I get to not pay it if i dont use it and ill sign on the dotted line. Until then keep your fucking hands out of my pockets and get your own healthcare with your own money.

Originally Posted by Dyshade

Nope. I do not mooch anything. I work. I do better work than most who realize that they can slack and the union will back thier asses if they are disciplined. I hav ealso seen the Union jack thier members around in cases where they were fired and the union hemmed and hawed until it was too late to do anything.
Plus 46bucks every 2 weeks is a bit much for me thank you I could pay 20 every 2 weeks and get better health care from the company themselves if I so wished.

Originally Posted by theburningbush

You understand the concept of premium right?

I doubt employers would continue offering healthcare benfits if there was a national plan. We may all just get a pay raise though which would offset the new tax burden.

I have healthcare I dont need national healthcare

Originally Posted by Billy the Kidd

So my standard of living will decrease, by going from grade A+ healthcare coverage to C- government coverage... thus making my need for healthcare more evident and I will have to pay MORE for private healthcare through another organization to offset the loses in my old coverage. So in essence I would be paying double what I pay now, PLUS the increase in Taxes, thanks but no thanks.