I can't be the only music major in here. Who else we got? What do you play? Where do/did you go for music school? Who was your teacher? I'm just kinda curious to see if there's anyone else aside from me.

what does having a degree that says you've passed some classes constitute a greater status of being a musician over someone without the piece of paper?

i'm a musician, fully, completely, utterly but i chose to get a degree in something else as a fall back plan. does that make me any less than a musician than you?

yes, i've taken offense to the way you worded this thread and more offense if you believe that a music degree is the only thing that signifies a 'musician'...

i'm a serious musician but not a major in it. but hey to each there own

Music classes, or a degree in music, does not a musician make, and even less so, a talented songwriter.

no, but there is a vast amount of information one can learn from music theory and the such.....and, it does make you a better musician...maybe not a songwriter, but definately a musician....itz practicing which further enhances your ability as you learn new techniques....

i was a band geek and the such in middleschool and highschool......percussion (SUCKA!) and bass for jazz band.....and i took music theory.....vidy, vidy interesting.....

i am a musician....drums for 14 yrs, guitar for 8, bass for 7, piano (somewhat) for about 5.......

been in bands since i was 15.....the band i'm currently in i'm the drummer....which is basically a first, as i was mainly the guitarist/songwriter.....itz all good though.....i totally kick ass at drums and aren't afraid to admit it.....i'm also a kick ass guitar player, and a purdy good bassist......i wanted to major in BASS at college, but they only offered classical guitar, and they suggested i should major in percussion, but no....i went for philosophy and english instead.....no regrets though

but yes....if you major in music, kudos to you........like any art-form, learning is always good......

I find the first post a little weird, as 'serious' is the wrong label to give someone just as they have studied music, as you can be serious without.
BUT, I agree with Sixx that knowledge of theory is a good thing.

I never understood people that don't take the time to learn the basics such as reading music. It's part of what you do, and can stretch you experiences and therefore enhance your talent.

And that's the word that really matters though, talent.
If you are incredibly talented studying is a good idea, but not doing it doesn't make you not 'serious'.
Just as we all know that studying something doesn't give you talent. I play the clarinet primarily, but have little natural talent, I've done my grades etc, but it's all technical, learned infomation. If I worked hard enough I could play in an orchestra, but it would always be mathematical rather than artistic.

If you ask me a serious musician is someone who IS a musician in their hearts, someone who takes it seriously, who gets their greatest enjoyment from it and either earns a living from it or wants to.
I may find the ability to sight read anything incredibly attractive in a man, but so is the abilty to pour his spirit and soul into a piece. You can't learn that.

hahahaha....you woodwind....hahahaha....you blow on wood

And I blow good....

I was a music major, but I moved on cause I couldn't see myself sticking it out as a high school music teacher the rest of my life.

At my highschool you would have been kicked in the dome for even referring to percussion and 'the band' in the same sentence (let alone calling yourself a 'band geek'). As a drumline, we even took a different bus to shows.

I sing whilst dancing around when I get outta the shower. I think that counts.

I've been dedicatedly drumming my ass off for 8 years, but I don't think I'm a serious drummer, since I wasn't music major.... you FUCKING MUSIC SNOB.

A knowledge of music theory does NOT make you a better musician unless you have no real musical talent to begin with.
A natural muscician understands instinctually the law of halfsteps. They do not need to be taught that, and will often pull off amazing things that a trained musician will not due to the trained musicians ideas that something shouldn't be done.
Not to mention, whos music theory are you referring to? Western? That's a pretty narrow outlook.
To top it off, as I said before, studying music in school does NOT make a good songwriter. In fact, it can often HURT songwriting. If a keychange or progression or scale sounds right to you, but music theory says it's invalid or 'wrong', you''ve just thrown away something that sounds right to you.
Believe me, all the shit thats written for your most beloved pop stars on your top 40 station were written by people with oodles of music degrees.
You want a job as a studio musician? Get a degree. Want to make your own music? Don't worry about it. Practice practice practice and a good ear are all that truly matters.

I agree with this person.

Yeah, except there are different music fields. If you want to go for a teaching position (aside from private) or music therapy or something else like that without a degree, good luck...

A music degree is not the only thing that signifies a musician, certainly. By "serious" I meant as your career path, not hobby.

Oh, yes, and music theory is more or less the entire basis for how music is written and provides for the very building blocks of music. Being a musician without at least a decent working knowledge of theory is like being illiterate.

Thats the most elitist, naive and untrue thuing I've ever heard.
Let's break it down.
Music theory, in it's truest form, is a set of rules defined by nothing less (and certainly nothing more) than aesthetics.
If we allow someone elses preferences concerning what sounds good and what doesn't dictate our own art, strictly because they are 'the rules', we've become less, much less, creative.
Again, a true musician does not require training or the ability to read music to understand and intrinsically use key changes, tempo changes, countermelodies, etc., to create the feeling they wish to convey with their given instrument.
In my band, there is one person with a degree in eastern music theory, one person who played violin in two symphonies, one who learned violin using the suzuki method, one with no training whatsoever, and the last, I don't know, and don't care, because he fucking rules his instrument.
We have absolutely no problem conveying what we need done within our group. The reason? We are all musicians. Not scholars. That's why we make music instead of study it.
To top it off, if you are going to write music using your theory instead of your ear, you ahd better know theory inside and fucking out, because you'll be missing all kinds of accidentals and modes that can make your music beautiful if you don't.
There is just so much wrong with your ideas here, I don't even know where to begin.

Let me add:
I believe Bach was possibly the greatest composer who ever lived, but I won't let peoples reliance on his compositions as theory dictate how I write if I hear something I like that doesn't jive with good ol' J.S.

no....i gotta disagree with Sub for one thing....

studying music DOES make you a better musician.....

even if you don't get formal training, you still study it to be a good musician.....i taught myself to play guitar by pulling up tabs from the internet.....that was studying, which made me a better musician......understand?

so, further studies do in fact make you a better musician......it never hurts to learn more about any art-form....it will make you better......

i do agree with you that studying music DOES NOT mean you'll become a better song-writer.....thatz just a gift some people have....

but studying music does make you a better musician....

i've been playing percussion for 14 yrs........each new style i learned (specifically jazz, but also marching, what insturment i played in marching, how to play and tune the pitch of kettle-drums, learning the vast amounts of percussion instruments, studying cadences, understanding dynamics, etc, etc, etc) has helped me progress further in my drumming ability....

the only drumming i have not been able to master is latin drumming.....which is just kinda like jazz (on the drumset) but the beats/rhythms are far more complex......if i studied it more thoroughly, and learned it, i would be better drummer to this date.....

i'm a kick-ass drummer.....but that doesn't mean i can't improve.....the only way to do so is study....

and....why else do musicians listen to a variety of music.....there's a difference between "listening" and "hearing".....everyday people hear, musicians listen.....why? because they're incoherently studying.....why? to learn something new....why? to get better.....

but again, that DOES NOT mean you'll be a better song-writer.....it does mean you'll be a better musician though.......

You and I are arguing a matter of semantics, sixxx.
I already stated that to get good, you needed to practice. A lot.
You are calling 'practive' studying, while studying, to me, signifies an organised institution (a school) requiring certain tasks to be done.
Other than that, I see nothing I disagree with in your last post.

This might seem redundant at this point, but oh well...

No one (while I skimmed this thread) seemed to point out that you don't need the actual piece of paper that says "Degree" to have picked up a bunch of books on music theory and decided to learn yourself without spending money on having someone lecture to you about music and etc, etc...

Like Submarine said, if you want to be a studio/session musician, get a degree. If you want to write good songs, you better be good at it instinctively otherwise your chances of sucking are pretty high.