Interview with Hironobu Sakaguchi:

Press: Has your approach to making Final Fantasy (the movie) been similar to making Final Fantasy (the video game)?

Sakaguchi: Going into it, I thought it would be somewhat similar, but as the project progressed I found that movie-making was very different from producing games. With games, there are cases where we do or we don't have the programs to do a specific thing. There are a couple of other factors that are different from making games. One is, obviously, the technology. There are cases where the programming or coding is limited, and the producers and the artists want a certain kind of image, but it's limited by the programming, and if the program can't handle it, it can't be done. Also, there are hardware limitations that prevented people from taking up the graphic level. In the case of movies, there are no such limitations, so the more we work on it, the better it gets. So one difficulty was limiting how far we go. And the other aspect was that in gaming -- there are highly specialized people. There are groups of artists, programmers, engineers and a whole technological side of the project that does its own thing. However, in a movie project, most people come from more of an artistic background; they are digital artists and consider themselves as artists. So their opinions go into the development of the image, and because of this, it is not just one section, but everyone commenting and giving input on how a scene should look or how an image should look, and it just becomes that much more difficult to tie everything together.

Press: At what point did you first conceive of the idea of the movie, and was that before or after a certain Final Fantasy game?

Sakaguchi: It was about the time when Final Fantasy VII was being created. That was the time when Square got heavily into computer graphics imagery. That was also the time when Toy Story came out.

Press: Are there any plans to make a Final Fantasy game based on what happens in the movie?

Sakaguchi: We don't have any immediate plans for that. With the current available hardware such as the PlayStation 2, we can't reproduce characters like Aki very well. But in the future, once the hardware evolves, there is a possibility that Aki will appear, somewhere. Furthermore, we want to use Aki as our lead actress, so she may be appearing in commercials and comedy movies and what not. Then, once the hardware is good enough, she will probably appear in games as well.

Press: The movie is rated PG-13, correct?

Aida: Yes.

Press: Now, do you think that's a risk, or did you want it to be rated PG-13 to be skewed towards an older audience? Were you reaching for an adult audience when you first envisioned this movie?

Aida: What do you mean by risk?

Press: Normally, animated features are rated G or PG.

Sakaguchi: Oh, I get it. But I don't like stories that are G and PG.

Aida: He [Sakaguchi] didn't want to pursue a story that appeals only to a younger audience. And we feel that by creating a PG-13 feature...certainly we're not going to do an R feature, that's too huge of a risk. But by creating something that will pass as a PG-13, we can still appeal to a wider audience, and yet still not be impacted by the content being too immature. We will be able to tell the story that the director really wanted to be able to tell. So it is very important for us to be able to create it as a PG-13 movie, and the thought of appealing to a younger audience never crossed our minds.

Press: You're obviously reaching for an older audience...the film has a lot of action, but at the same time, did you want to create an emotional resonance in the viewer by creating a love story as well as a drama/action film?

Sakaguchi: That's certainly the intention. You probably didn't see it in the trailer you saw, but outside of that, there are a lot of emotional -- high drama -- scenes in the movie. It's certainly the intent to combine that with the action.

Press: Do you see this as the next step to animated movies, or do you feel like you're creating a new type of movie that isn't necessarily based on what animated movies have done in the past?

Sakaguchi: At first, I honestly didn't know what genre of movie I was making, but as we get closer to the final product, I realize that it's nothing like other movies out there. At least that's what I hope people will get out of seeing this movie. (Laughs) I think it's safe to say that it's an entirely new form of movie.

Press: Now that you've done both -- made games and movies -- how would you compare the two? Which one do you prefer?

Sakaguchi: (Laughs) When I'm working on a game, I would much rather be making a movie, and when I'm making a movie, I'd rather be working on a game, because it's very arduous.

Aida: He goes through a lot of tough moments either way, so when he's making interactive games, he's thinking about featured films, and vice versa.

Press: As a filmmaker, who are some of the directors and what are some of the movies that have inspired you?

Sakaguchi: Basically, none. I've been inspired by the movies I've seen, but I can't name one specific director or movie that I've been inspired by.

Press: This movie seems like a departure from the traditional Final Fantasy style -- swords and magic. Why did you decide to call it Final Fantasy?

Sakaguchi: Well, if you think about it, FFVII or FFVIII were actually departures from the magic/sword elements, although we do have them in the games, so it wasn't that big of a departure. The base theme is close to VII and IX, so people who've played the game and see the movie will be able to realize that it is indeed a Final Fantasy movie. Rather than copying the Final Fantasy world using the names of spells and dragons, I thought it would be better if I used the underlying theme of the Final Fantasy series. I want the audience to make ties at that level.

Press: You mean at an emotional level?

Sakaguchi: Movies based on games seem to fail because they just try to recreate the game world. They simply recreate the characters and such, and as a result, the viewers become fixated on that. If the storyline is done properly, it's fine, but it usually turns out pretty predictable. I didn't want this movie to be a simple off-shoot of the game. The stories of the individual Final Fantasy games are very different, but there's that distinct impression that it is indeed a Final Fantasy game. Even though the story and the world are very different from the Final Fantasy series, I think people will still be able to come away from the movie with the belief that it is indeed a part of the Final Fantasy series.

Press: Was it your intention from the very beginning for the movie to be set in the future? Did you ever consider setting it against a backdrop of more primitive technology -- the more Final Fantasy medieval atmosphere? Because this will be technically considered as science fiction. Did you consider doing this from the very beginning?

Sakaguchi: The reason why I said it's similar to VII and IX is because people die, and the characters close to the deceased go through emotional turmoil. I wanted to portray those kinds of emotional scenes in the movie. And at the point when I decided this, I already knew that I wanted to make the movie set in the future rather than the past. I wanted a world where life was studied and understood scientifically. I decided on that pretty early on.

Press: What was the motivation for setting the movie on Earth rather than a fictional world like the games are set in?

Sakaguchi: Either way was fine, but because we wanted to go with the realistic angle, we decided to set it on Earth. We wanted to challenge ourselves in creating human characters that look as real as possible. Had we set the movie on a different world, it would have given us leeway, such as creating characters with pointy ears. We needed to set it on Earth so that people would compare it to real humans, and we can't get away with mistakes.

Press: Has computer technology finally gotten to the point where you can pretty much fully express everything you want to do, or are there still limitations? Did you still have to hold back ideas, or has technology gotten to the point where you can fully express all the ideas that you had?

Sakaguchi: Actually, technologically, if we didn't put a stop to it, would keep things getting better and better -- such as the face -- but we would never get the movie done, so we had to put a stop to it once the graphics got to a certain level. I'm really pleased with the level we attained. However, if we wanted to, we could have certainly improved a lot more. Technologically, we could have gone much, much higher. But we did get to a good level. As a result, we took twice as much resources as we originally planned to use.

Press: Are you surprised and pleased at the amazing level of detail of the expressions on the face and of the textures?

Sakaguchi: Faces are something that people look at a good amount throughout their lives. Because we grow up looking at other humans' faces, if there is a slight difference in the human facial feature, that person may seem very different and foreign to us -- they look very alien. And that's what a CG character looked like previously. Whenever you look at a CG character, there's something different about it. I think other CG characters look like aliens. However, I don't think our characters look alien...they look and feel like regular humans. I think that was an amazing feat of technology that we were able to accomplish. I think it's o.k. to look at Aki and be convinced that she's human.

Press: Were there moments of frustration where you wanted more, but technology just would not allow it at this time?

Sakaguchi: It's been like that the entire last three-and-a-half years.

Press: Are there any plans to work on a second Final Fantasy movie? Have there been any official plans to make a second movie?

Aida: We're working on the concept of a second feature. We don't have a title yet, but a director just finished a treatment, so we're going to be sharing that with our partner, Columbia Pictures. Our hope is to start the production of a second feature right after we wrap here, which will be next summer. We will go right into production for the second feature.

Press: Will you continue in this facility? (The Honolulu studio office that this interview was conducted in.)

Aida: That's our plan. We spent all this money creating this great studio! (Laughs) It's got the best view of any feature animation studio. Nice weather here, too.

Press: Having done the first film, do you see feature animation taking less time, now that you've gone through the process once?

Aida: I'd say "yes" for two reasons. As a studio, we are now more mature than we were three years ago -- more talented people, more organization, and so on and so forth. So, given the same playing field, we should be able to produce our next feature in less time. Also, the technology is always improving. For example, the new rendering technology we're going to be using for the next feature should render the images in a shorter time, so combining those two factors, the director says not half, but about two-thirds the amount of time compared to the first feature.

Press: Mr. Aida, coming from a film background with Street Fighter [the movie], how does traditional filmmaking differ from digital filmmaking?

Aida: It's a completely different process. In live action film production, the principal photography is three, four months, tops -- usually. We started the principal photography two years ago. It's a different process. There's a big difference in production value. You can't compare the two. But this has been a very, very rewarding experience for me.

Press: With the Final Fantasy games introducing new plots and new characters with each new episode, do you foresee the same kind of thing with the film? Having established some of these characters with the first film, will you bring them back in a future film?

Sakaguchi: I definitely want to bring Aki back as our main digital actress. As with any actress, we'd like to see her in other features. However, we certainly plan to bring in new characters. But because Aki is a CG character, we can have the advantage of having her at any age. We can even have her come back as a 16-year-old girl.

Press: After this, do you think it will change the way people make movies? Do you think it will change the way people make games?

Sakaguchi: One of the things that will crossover and influence how games are made is that in a movie project, we rely heavily on a very reliable database system that manages the way data is handled. This is very important in movie production, and as of yet, this has not been used in game production. I see it as a big thing that can transfer over to game production and change how that's done. It's one of the many things that can be transferred over to game production.

Press: When this movie comes out on DVD, have you thought about including additional features in the DVD?

Aida: Good question. (Laughs) We've been asked that question before, and with the PS2 being DVD compatible, we are working on a very interactive product. Namely, you will be able to render certain sequences of the movie in real time, and be your own director, and change camera angles and shots. That's the enhanced interactive capability that our research and development team is producing currently. Hopefully, that will go on the PS2 version of the DVD.

Press: So there will be a dual PlayStation 2 version and a regular DVD version?

Aida: That's our goal.

Press: How else are you planning to place marketing tie-ins of the movie with the Final Fantasy games coming out next year, and later with the video release? Marketing and cross-promoting versus tying it in directly with Final Fantasy X and XI.

Aida: We'll cross-promote the products. But again, because X doesn't have any story relationship with the movie, it's just dependent on market timing when such material is released, whether we can cross-promote the two or not.

Press: What are you ultimately trying to achieve with Final Fantasy (the movie)? Is there one thing that you want people to come away with?

Sakaguchi: Ultimately, I'd like people to think and reflect on this movie whenever they are faced with hard times -- such as the passing of a loved one. I want them to remember the movie, and think, "I wanna watch that movie again," or reflect on the themes of the movie...that sort of thing. But, I don't want you to think the movie is depressing or anything. (Laughs)

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Here is where 2 more people enter the scene. Andy Jones, animation director and Chris Lee, the second producer of the movie.
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Press: What's the funniest thing you've learned on the project so far?

Andy Jones: (Laughs)

Chris Lee: (To Jones) Well, why don't you just speak about the physical production aspects of it.

Andy Jones: Um...basically for me, it's being able to create life. It's an animator's dream to work on life that looks so real. People actually can believe it's life. It's alive, that's always been most fun.

Chris Lee: For me, it's being involved with a movie that started four years ago as just a conception from Sakaguchi. And, as a person who worked at the studios for thirteen years -- I've been a producer now for two years -- and I've been involved in a lot of different movies in that time period, just to work on something that is truly revolutionary both in terms of execution and concept and everything. And, I also think it's the literal conversions of games into films...we've seen a lot of instances of games converted to films that have not been successful, and some have been quite successful, but there's never been one that's been created by the creator of the game itself. So I think that's a very exciting development, and it's a testament to Sakaguchi's desire to challenge the visual envelopes and go literally to where no other technical studios have gone. Not that they probably couldn't do it, but they did not choose to deploy their resources that way.

Press: This is Mr. Sakaguchi's first film, and he's only worked on games in the past. What was he like to work with? Were there any learning curves?

Andy Jones: I think he's just a great storyteller. I think he's got a very good story sense and a visual mind for that. I haven't worked with him on games before, but everyone who's worked with him -- like Sakamura -- says that it's been a pleasure working with him. And it has been for me. "It's a pleasure working with him on games" is what they say. It's mainly his story-driven nuance and how he perceives a lot of the imagery and a lot of the camera work...stuff like that. He's got a very good eye.

Chris Lee: I think also obviously one of the hallmarks of the Final Fantasy games here, as well as the rest of the square canon whether it is Vagrant Story or Parasite Eve and the upcoming Bouncer, is that they are like movies. The full-motion videos are incredible. Nobody renders character animation like Square does. And the common thread is the quality of storytelling and the quality of the visuals. So I think it was a relatively easy jump for him from gaming to features, and I know that one of the very first discussions we had years ago was that he recognized the need to replace the interactive nature of gaming, and particularly role-playing, with the storytelling demands of a motion picture medium.

Andy Jones: He's already had a very cinematic approach to games, so it translates easily.

Chris Lee: And if you also look at what Chris Roberts did with Wing Commander -- and I know Chris is a good guy but -- it wasn't a good movie either way, but if you knew nothing about the game, you really were at a complete and utter loss. So when Mr. Sakaguchi approached this, he basically threw everything out that people might know about Final Fantasy, and said, "It's going to have that name, and it's going to be fused with the spiritual nature of all Final Fantasy games, and deal with the issues of death and life and love. But it's not going to be beholden to what the franchise game is, so that anybody entering into the movie theater who hasn't played the game can understand it."

Press: It must be exciting for you to just be able to share in a movie like this...because you talked about how he (Sakaguchi) is a cinematic storyteller using spirituality and a much more adult-oriented story that we don't really see in animated features. It must be fantastic for you guys to be able to create something like this and imagine something like this. Like you said, "Create this life." It must be fantastic.

Andy Jones: It is, and I think it really fits in the medium too, the nature of the story and how adult the story is -- what we're trying to do as far as animation -- taking it to the next step and also taking the story there, too. The demographics for the movie is 12 to...

Chris Lee: Yes, 12 to 34 probably is our core audience I'd say, similar to the game.

Andy Jones: But it's definitely a good story, all ages will enjoy it.

Breaking into the American Market
Press: This sort of ties in to what you're saying, but do you anticipate any difficulties in marketing the movie, because maybe it is not quite an animated movie in a way that the U.S. audience has thought of animated movies? And yet, it is not quite an action movie as we are used to like a live action movie. And in Japan, there might be more of a tradition of animated movies that are geared towards adults, but are you worried about the U.S.?

Chris Lee: Well, Hollywood is kind of like the law, it's based on precedent -- nobody likes to go first. But the really great lawyers are the ones who create law rather than just embellish it. And so there is always risk by being the first one out there. And if we didn't have the level of quality thanks to artists like Andy, then I would say, "Yeah." Is it a marketing challenge? I'm not even sure what the junket is going to look like...for example, a traditional junket has the stars there and stuff like that.

(Laughs from everyone)

Chris Lee: So we are still working things out. But earlier, I referred to a convergence of gaming and film and I think that the audience that we care most about -- the ones that care most about this product -- is going to be right there with us. I have macro theories about how gaming has changed aesthetics and storytelling for the growing audience today. I think gaming has really changed how an audience views things. And I think The Matrix is an excellent example of a movie that is literally a game: it has different levels, different environments, you have to learn how to fight, and so its watchers are deeply influenced by that.


Press: In terms of Sakaguchi and Aida's talk about a second picture, have you thought about how you will take things to the next level, animation-wise?

Andy Jones: Along the way, we definitely saw things that we could improve upon. We're at a stage right now in which we are improving as we go, but we can only take things so far so that it still matches the stuff that we've already done. I think there are huge improvements that we can make for the next one as far as taking the technology even further, making the people look even more realistic, and making environments look even more realistic.

Press: Do you think there will be a lot of improvements in facial animation?

Andy Jones: Yeah, a lot in facial animation. Lighting has a lot to do with that, too. I don't know how much we can talk about it, but we have an in-house rendering package that we are developing...it's a whole different approach to CG light. It basically enables global illumination where you have a lot more bounce lighting. It's already out there. Computer-rendered imagery, but until now, it's been extremely expensive to render. Render times are 10, 20, 30, 100 times slower than what we are doing now, but we are developing it so...[turns to public relations representative]?

Square USA PR Rep: I think that's enough. (Smiles)

Andy Jones: But, we are developing ways to make it a lot faster and a lot more efficient -- cheaper to render.

Press: You were talking about how it might be difficult to market, but one thing you guys will have is additional games coming out that expose the movie to a new audience. It's not directly related to the film, but it will create a sort of brand name.

Chris Lee: You mean FF games?

Press: Yeah, X and XI coming out.

Chris Lee: When someone runs a studio, and as a producer, you first have to ask yourself, "Can I market it?" Particularly when you are talking about this level of budget commitment. And one of the things I knew from the start was that PS2 was coming, and we could cross-promote with PS2 because it was a DVD-based piece of machinery and the Final Fantasy games would continue on that format. So for instance, if you buy a PS2 -- if you can get your hands on one -- you guys probably can, but...if you register for it, you can get an exclusive trailer on a DVD disk. In Final Fantasy IX, which is on PS one, we made up special artwork from the movie and threw it in there. And, I think on The Bouncer, we're putting a clip on The Bouncer or something...are we? [Turns to public relations representative]

Square USA PR Rep: No, it's just going to have the same insert.

Chris Lee: And when X comes out, which will be the first Final Fantasy game for the PS2, there will be a trailer coded on the disk, as far as I know. There are those opportunities to cross-market between the groups.

Press: How did you go about casting the voice talent for the movie? Did you have people in mind in the early stages?

Chris Lee: We pretty much got all the voices that we wanted, I think. There were a couple of people that scheduling didn't work out, like Peri Gilpin. Originally, it was Janeane Garofalo, and it was just a scheduling issue in terms of when she could record for us...but we pretty much got everyone we wanted. The creation of the characters themselves, which from what I understand, is one of the toughest things about this job -- creating new people, and not just digitizing an existing actor. But how could you possibly come up with a person out of nothing? It started long before we actually put the voices together. So even though in the script, there was a black soldier, and Aki was maybe half-Japanese or something -- it was a little unclear -- we just went after the best people we could think of. And Alec [Baldwin] and Ming-na...this is Steve Buscemi's first animated feature, which is very exciting for us. One thing that was very important to me was that the DEEPEYES [the soldiers] have a good sense of humor, and be able to do a lot of lines on their own. And that came out -- it wasn't exactly scripted -- some of the quips that they do and everything...but, we went with Buscemi and Ving Rhames and Peri -- from Fraiser. And Jimmy Woods [James Woods] is the ultimate bad guy, and Donald Sutherland is just...amazing. You didn't see clips with him, but he's so terrific. He brings such balance to the part of Dr. Cid, the scientist who is a mentor to Aki.


Press: What impact do you think this film will have on Hollywood? The animation has over the years evolved from Toy Story up to Dinosaur, and more and more studios are getting into CG, but what impact do you think this movie will have?

Chris Lee: I think other people will want to do it. I think it's a form or application of technology that doesn't make sense for say, romantic comedy or an Adam Sandler movie, but it does make sense for a Jim Cameron movie or Matrix-like movies, and big canvas movies. It really does allow us to go to worlds and places where you couldn't do live action, or if you did, it would be even more expensive then what the movie would cost as it is -- far more expensive, I think. I don't know who will do this besides Square, to be honest with you, because even though everyone starts off with the same software package basically -- Softimage or Maya or whatever -- it's about the proprietary software built by Andy and his group -- how they have applied it -- because for whatever reasons, I'm not aware of any of our friendly competitors: Digital Domain, Pixar, ILM [Industrial Light and Magic] doing this kind of work or attempting it. I don't think Shrek is doing it, which is PDI, which is coming out from DreamWorks in May. It's an all-digital movie, also. It's probably more realistic than say, Toy Story, but most of the CGI stuff I've seen just looks like a cartoon to me, which is a lot easier to render than what these guys have accomplished.

Press: Will CG ever replace actors? Will there be more movies where all the characters are comprised of CG?

Chris Lee: No.

Andy Jones: No.

Chris Lee: First of all, you mentioned how we choose the actors, and we go out and pick the best. Those actors, as good as Andy's work is, would not have come to life for you on the screen if we didn't have those performances.

Andy Jones: They drive the performances. Jimmy Woods drives the performance. Donald Sutherland...in a lot of ways, they are still the main actors. We're not using their bodies, but we are still using their voices just like any animation.

Chris Lee: More people will probably come online and attempt to do this in their filmmaking, but it will be a relatively small percentage of films overall. Because, if you take a romantic comedy or more traditional movie -- a thriller or something -- there's not much reason to go to this length. Disney has had great success in their animated musicals because they figured out a way to make musicals -- which for whatever reason, the audience has rejected as a form in live action. But, in the format of a cartoon, such as an animated feature by Disney, people can sing and dance in the middle of the street. [Meaning that, certain movie genres are appropriate for animation, like musicals, and others, like romantic comedies, are not.]

Andy Jones: There's also the argument that we've employed two actors basically for every character, not just one. Cause you got the motion-capture and the voice and then you have the animator, so basically, three.

Chris Lee: But, it is true that these guys [the animators] are bringing the people to life, but it is driven by the talent of the actual actors.

Cool. I like the way this guy thinks.

It seems like all Japanese people think better than us doesn't it.....

Eh, some.

depends on who u talk to... but most of america has lost its poetic flare...

Exactumoondo...