I only speak on what I see. You telling someone they have your pity for following a certain religion is not right. Like I said before we all have the right to believe whatever we want to believe. I never said I know you and I never tried to judge you. I was speaking on your post, which I thought was out of line. If that kind of talk was directed at me I would feel offended.

Why because I pity a person who belongs to a religion who once believed that those who did not belong to their faith should either convert or die? Because he belongs to one of the most narrow-minded and unilluminated groups in the world, who are heading backwards since the death of the last pope(Despite my disdain for catholisism, I do have respect for a man who is more focused with helping others than spreading the agenda of the groups he leads). Gee I am so sorry for having an opinion. If people don't want to hear the thoughts of others, they do have the right to say nothing. In a public forum such as this you say what you say at your own risk, for better or for worse, and in this place, if that bothers you, then your on the wrong forums.

Uzziah -

If someone can choose to follow a faith and/or like it for some reasons, and those reasons be perfectly valid and they reserve the right to them, why can't someone have the right to reasons not to be part of and/or like that faith and those reasons be valid?

You're basically saying that a person's reasons for having any faith are invalid, because if someone is catholic and has reason to be, then they have reason to not believe/follow all the other faiths in the world.

Therefore, nobody has any right to any belief or religion whatsoever, because to show preference is wrong.

No, I think both of you are taking my words the wrong way. I never said anything against what you just stated Tozzy. I merely pointed out that Nox noctis Umbra telling someone "you have my pity" just for saying they follow a particular religious demonination is wrong. What makes his views more valid? That Wry guy only said he was Catholic and he is then subjected to this mockery from Nox, that's messed up.

it boils down to faith. a wiccan cast a spell and beleaves it will work. a cristian prays to god and beleaves he will make it happen. both use faith.

In other words Tozzy, I am wrong for stating the fact that I pity a person who believes in the catholic faith, however going off of that logic, anyone who as stated any negative opinion or thought(or in my case, a factual statement of an opinion, which is what I said shall be classified as) about something else someone feels strongly about, we are all in the wrong. However if numbnuts would go through the whole thread(I do realize its long) I seem to recall stating various times my reason for disliking orgainized faiths, however I have no real problems with the people in it unless they are trying to push their faith on me, so I will state this once more in big bold letters, and this time I will say what I believe is more valid for the reason of why I believe what I believe:


GOD DOESN'T CARE ABOUT WHAT FAITH YOU BELONG TO, HE/SHE/IT CARES ABOUT THE FACT THAT YOU HAVE FAITH IN THE FIRST PLACE, ALL ELSE IS TRIVIAL BULLSHIT
Believing in God has nothing to do with being apart of one massive group, believing in God is about having faith in his existence, and about following that faith in him, not doing what some dick wearing fancy robes and a funny hat says what he thinks God wants you to do. One of the most arrogant statments a person can make is saying they know the will of God, because God told them so
Sorry, I'm done

That's not what I said. I said I found it rude and arrogant that you told that new guy "you have my pity" when all he did was stated he was Catholic. In my eyes that's asking for trouble. What gives you the right to tell someone you pity them? What makes what you believe any closer to truth than his? Exactly, nothing, as we are all equal and all have our own ideas and faiths. But let us not dwell on old matters, keeping on discussing this nonsense is just boring and directionless, so let's move on.

Dude, if you really truly believe what I said was bad, you really really need to read the whole fucking thread. I have said the same if not similar things to many people on this thread, and none, not a one has taken it in the manner you have. As I have said, people post on here at their own risk. You don't like it, take a hike. By the way if I were such an elitist I would truly belive that I am better than the people here in every way. I do not, I just feel that faith based groups are nothing more than a means of control, and should be dissolved to allow people the chance to believe the way they feel they should believe, instead of forcing them to conform to a secular believe, and if you have a problem with that, then fuck off.

It's not that I personally felt offended, I was just speaking on behalf of that ~Wry~ whom I don't even know, it's just that what I read I didn't like. I understand most of the stuff you said, it's just I felt your post was arrogant, maybe just because of the way it came out. I disagree with what you just said in there about faith-based groups being nothing more than a means of control. I believe that people always have the right too choose what they want to believe, but I feel that most who do follow a strict religion have freely chosen to believe in it, rather than the idea that they are being as you said forced to conform. I have no problem with what you believe, and never did have. What I had a problem with was the way a noobie turns up, says he is Catholic and then immediately gets answered with "you have my pity". I viewed that as negativity. I do not plan on going anywhere, but I will try not to be so hasty the next time I see a member such as yourself post something like that here.

Dude, its survival of the fittest around here. always has been, and probably always will be. If a person cannot fend for themselves, then as I have said, its the wrong place.

I understand that and like I said I will try to show more acceptance in future. I guess I did jump the gun a little.

Sorry Nox, i wasn't knocking you at all.

I was trying to point out that what he was saying was absolutely fucking retarded, by posting such a stupidly retarded point of view and statement.

Well, to put my coppers worth in.. ~wry~ has my pity too..

And not one person has the right to knock me for it either..

I was raised catholic, was an alter boy, and went 8 years to a Catholic school..





now you folks can pity me as well.. LOL

Perhaps I shouldn't have posted at all.

By the way, I am very happy being Catholic Nox, and though the Church has made mistakes in the past, and might continue to in the future, it isn't meant to be perfect. It's human. Humans are fallible. People in positions of power become greedy and make mistakes. However, there is ussually someone to help us. Gregory the Great, Pious, John Paul II, etc.

About the argument and its validations and points, I believe that Nox's first comment was a bit offensive, although I'm used to critiscism. I apologize for having started an argument that may have led to anyone being offended, etc etc.

You should never apologize for starting an argument. Arguments are an excellent basis for conversation

Fuck it all, just fuck everything lol. I'm tired of arguing.

My older sister and her two kids are catholic. I think Pope Benedict is gonna take the church in the wrong direction. And anyone who thinks that their faith group, regardless of if its christian, muslim, judaism(sp?), or mormon, is the one true religion is arrogant and foolish. No body has it right, not me, not you, no one. I just have a tough time thinking that god is someone who is gonna say "O.k. Lutherans have it right, everyone else is wrong, so they go to heaven, and everyone else is screwed" no, I don't think so. And Catholics and Mormons tend to be the loudest about it, then the muslim extremists, and then everyone else

Atheists claim they are completely right just as much as anyone else does, and are becoming somewhat elitest.

But now I'm with Uzziah's philosophy. This is going to get old pretty soon.