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Life after death - 01-22-03

Is there life after death?
  
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01-22-03

Nobody knows, but i imagine that there is not. Not in any real sense. All the major Religions promise that there is something after death, but that is their appeal...and their power.

When we die, our bodies cease to function. Organs stop doing what is required to keep our system ticking along. When the Brain itself dies, we are effectively gone. Just before this point of total shutdown, people can be brought back. Some people have even described the experience. A mixture of chemicals and the progressive turning off of parts of the Brain, seems to generate an internal focus of perception. As signals from the senses are lost, the mind retreats into itself. Signals from the eyes are interpreted as being like a tunnel of light, surrounded by darkness. The mind often imprints images onto this, which it finds appropriate. These images are influenced by a rush of chemicals, which make the last moments of the individual euphoric and peaceful. Some people see Jesus, or Angels, or even a relative. It depends, but all seem to be intended for maximum comfort of the dying individual.

After the Brain shuts down completely, it is hard to say what might happen. Personally, i believe that to be the end of the individual. It is possible that some kind of energy matrix joined to, but seperate from, the organic Brain exists, but there is no real evidence of this. If such a matrix existed, we might survive beyond this life.


~As soon as a religion comes to dominate it has as its opponents all those who would have been its first disciples. ~ Nietzsche


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01-22-03

Quote:
Originally posted by Vallisk

After the Brain shuts down completely, it is hard to say what might happen. Personally, i believe that to be the end of the individual. It is possible that some kind of energy matrix joined to, but seperate from, the organic Brain exists, but there is no real evidence of this. If such a matrix existed, we might survive beyond this life.

Rather depressing subject to discuss, but it will happen and only God knows?

What is this "energy matrix" you speak of, and what are the possibilities of it existing?

Personally, i think people believe in life after death because it gives them hope that death isn't the end.
  
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01-25-03

I am not sure if there is life after death but I imagine that if there is we would know? I would not want it to be the end. But would anyone want to live for eternity?


"The great art of life is the sensation, to feel that we exist, even in pain" Author Unknown
  
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01-26-03

Live for eternity..no. We're all going to be wiped out by a super volcano, anyway. Who wants to be around when that happens?
  
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01-26-03

i think our souls go on living onto another life after this one's shell ceases to exist. but hey, that just my opinion after all.


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01-28-03

I thought about all these ideas, but i still don't have the answer. I'll find out sooner or later. Everybody does


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02-05-03

to tell you the truth i have no idea. but if there isn't life after death then how come we have ghost and spirits roaming around the earth? that right there is telling that is some what possible.
  
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02-05-03

Your mind is different from your brain.

Energy can only be converted never destroyed. After you die your energy.. your essense.. your mind.. should continue to exist. Not in the same form that it is now.. but another form.. a non-physical form.

I don't have any solid proof but niether do the people who claim that there is no life after death.
  
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02-05-03

interesting point.
  
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02-05-03

Well everything in nature seems to work in cycles, the seasons, the revolution of planets, the rock cycle, the water cycle, electricity, light energy to heat energy to mechanical energy and so forth, so I don't think reincarnation is totally out of the question. Seems more eco-efficient to recycle souls than to keep creating new ones and throwing the old ones away. As Yoda said, "Lumionous beings are we, not this crude matter"

Then again may I'm just using it as a crutch so I can keep myself sane in my day to day corporeal life.


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02-05-03

well we do raise the dead. i know thats a scary thaught.
  
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02-05-03

If it were possible to talk to an unborn baby in the womb, and explain to it that it was about to go through a traumatic and painfull transition into a reality that it has no way of comprehending, full of sensations and experiences it could not begin to imagin, it would be terrified, and probably not want to be born. But now, having experienced life,would any of us want to go back to the womb? I see death as the same kind of "birth" ....into a whole new way of being. The transition may be messy and painfull, but once we get there, we may not have any desire to go back. And who knows how many "births" lie ahead of us? In the womb we only undergo physical growth. In this life we undergo physical, emotional, mental, and spiritual growth. In the next life we discard physical growth, but continue with the other 3, and who knows what else. Remember...it is only who you become, and what you learn here that you can take with you to "the other side". Nothing else matters.
  
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02-06-03

If people can raise the dead, i'd love to see a public display of that. Or real evidence of Ghosts, for that matter. Not pictures of dirt on lenses, light reflections and mist.

Basically, i think we end. That is the best theory of what happens to us, that i have. The most supported and the most logical. Not very optimistic, but reality is not ideal.


~As soon as a religion comes to dominate it has as its opponents all those who would have been its first disciples. ~ Nietzsche


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thoughts on the matter - 02-19-03

Ok, I have a thought or two on the matter, but it requireas a little setup, so bear with me.

I would consider first that there is more in this universe that we don't know than there is that we ever will. We as human beings only use a small portion of our brains, and can only comprehend a small portion of light and sound frequencies. And it seems every year some scientist discovers some new frequency of radiation that can't be seen or felt by human beings, but would slowly immolate our bodies were we to be exposed to it. We have also plotted matter down to the sub-atomic level, but still don't know what exists between the electrons and nucleus of any atom. It can't be a vacume, but it seems to be empty space. So what's there? String theory attempts to explain, but that's way too much to go into in one post. We also know that to an extent, humanity has a collective memory (as was proven by the now infamous "crossword" experiment).

So where I'm going with this is that knowing that humanity has some sort of connected super-consiousness, and that there's so much unexplored within our existing minds, there could be a heaven, hell, or whatever right here, just between the spaces of our reality on some level that the small used portion of our minds can't comprehend, and would probably madden us if we did. Part of an individual could be sitting there at some incomprehensible level, and that "soul" (for lack of a better word) could only be barely reflected in our level of reality. With this in mind (and considering various religious explanations of afterlife in the context of this) I find it difficult to believe that there isn't anything beyond death.

But that's just me.


RobertK
Current's surround me, and drowsily swaying,
Far on the moon-path I seek the sweet face.
Eagerly, hasting, half panting, half praying,
Forward I reach for the vision of grace.
Murmuring waters about me are closing,
Soft the sweet vision advances to me.
Done are my trials; my heart is reposing
Safe with my Unda, the Bride of the Sea.
~~H.P. Lovecraft~~
  
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02-20-03

Quote:
Originally posted by Vallisk
If people can raise the dead, i'd love to see a public display of that. Or real evidence of Ghosts, for that matter. Not pictures of dirt on lenses, light reflections and mist.

Basically, i think we end. That is the best theory of what happens to us, that i have. The most supported and the most logical. Not very optimistic, but reality is not ideal.
I want to ask how is it logical?
And does it explain the huge difference between a living person and a newly dead person, if the human body Is just a Organic robot that shuts down then how come they cannot be just turned on again? Or how about the feeling that something that was in the body is no longer there?


May Chaos Be Visited Upon You.
  
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02-20-03

I don't worry about it. If there is great, we get to keep playing. If not, being worm food ain't all that bad. It just seems kinda sad to me that the religious beliefs of so many folks are driven by a fear off death. Seems to me they need to re-evaluate their view of life.

Namaste


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02-20-03

Quote:
Originally posted by Necropolis
I want to ask how is it logical?
And does it explain the huge difference between a living person and a newly dead person, if the human body Is just a Organic robot that shuts down then how come they cannot be just turned on again? Or how about the feeling that something that was in the body is no longer there?
We already know that the body is a series of organs, working together to maintain the overall function of the whole. We can point to the Brain and safely say that it contains our memories and our being. Brain injury can change your whole personality, and wipe clean your memories. We don't fully understand it, no, but i do not think anyone would argue that the Brain is not the driving force for our physical bodies and our mental domain.

Now, death to me, means the death of the Brain. Your body can die and be revived, but if the Brain dies it is over for that person. Personality and memories are lost, and the person is reduced to a mass of organic matter. I see no evidence for a soul leaving, merely the failure of the controlling organ.

Some people like to say they have three aspects: physical; mental; and spiritual. I think we have only the first two. The spiritual side is a sub-category of the mental side. Part of what makes us human is our desire to question and seek reason. It is a result of having such a large Brain, capable of complex thought. Every Society is built on our basic need for reason. People do things for a reason, so it must extend outwards and upwards, so that there is a reason for us being here? I think that misses the point. We have the most advanced Brains on the planet. We should use them to investigate the Universe around us, not fall back on to what we would like to be the case.


~As soon as a religion comes to dominate it has as its opponents all those who would have been its first disciples. ~ Nietzsche


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02-20-03

I have heard that some scientists think that some of the mental functions happen outside the brain.
But even so if the brain is damaged and it is the focal point of my personalty/spirit entery into the world then wouldn't that cause a severe personality change also? Also brain damage doesn't really account for personality change completely because it has to be there in the first place to come out, and people's personalities are more than just one sided.
It was also believed that the bumble be should not be able to fly, until someone realized that not everything was taken into account. We know so little about our bodies these don't even count as edcated guesses, even from a specialist.


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02-22-03

Quote:
Originally posted by Necropolis
I have heard that some scientists think that some of the mental functions happen outside the brain.
But even so if the brain is damaged and it is the focal point of my personalty/spirit entery into the world then wouldn't that cause a severe personality change also? Also brain damage doesn't really account for personality change completely because it has to be there in the first place to come out, and people's personalities are more than just one sided.
It was also believed that the bumble be should not be able to fly, until someone realized that not everything was taken into account. We know so little about our bodies these don't even count as edcated guesses, even from a specialist.
Perhaps some Scientists do, but they are speculating, at best. There is no hard evidence. If they come up with anything substantial on the subject, then that would change things slightly. Even if it were the case, that information processing took place in some field generated by the Brain, this would still only be an example of the organ itself working; not evidence for a soul or spirit.

At the end of the day, you can go with what is supported by evidence at the moment, or you can go with what you would like to be the case. You can support your decision with subjective evidence and emotive arguments, but it is still what you desire to be the case.


~As soon as a religion comes to dominate it has as its opponents all those who would have been its first disciples. ~ Nietzsche


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