hmmm, i've seen some people throwing around the fact that nothing comes from nothing, ex nihilo nihil fit, etc etc. and this seems rather intuitive, i'll admit, but can you really prove it? it sounds like more of an assumption than a fact.

and as far as i know nothing related to science is hard fact. not even newton's law, hooke's law, etc. scientific laws just mean that by applying them one achieves consistent results. in fact, the conservation of momentum and energy is not described as being a fact of nature. they say that no experiments have ever disproven it. science is empirical by nature, and is meant to be useful rather than true. useful in describing the world around us. we can extrapolate what we think might be true about the world by what we see and how we think it works, but that doesn't mean it is a hard fact. science isn't concerned with the truth, science is concerned with finding the tricks we can use to make the most of everything. that's really it. in conclusion, i am in full agreement with stygianeyes.

and i agree with billy about christianity. forget the stories, look at the message. if you read the bible literally and still believe it all, you might as well believe in grendel, liliputians, yahoos, moby dick and peter pan.

and finally, i personally believe that science's main purpose is not to discover the truth behind mankind's past. certainly such a practical understanding may be beneficial in the future, but perhaps we could take the far distant past for granted and focus on the future? scientifically speaking, knowledge in its own right is quaint but without value. what you are able to do with said knowledge is key. 'scientists' who concern themselves with questions having no immediate physical relevance to the outside world are actually philosophers. science implies use.

and i think kingofdarkness really hit the nail on the head. i think it's been the universe that's always been here. why introduce god where god isn't needed? the physical world doesn't need god. if god is needed anywhere, it's inside our souls and minds as intelligent, spiritual beings.